Windows 11 Thread

Discussion in 'Software' started by sonichedgehog360, Jun 5, 2021.

  1. sonichedgehog360

    sonichedgehog360 AKA Hifihedgehog Senior Member

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    I just tried updating to Windows 11 (via ISO image) on my Surface Pro 7+. For some reason or another, when the update finished (and I watched it the whole way through), it showed the Windows 10 Start Button. :eek: Was Redmond reading my head after my scathing comments today? In all seriousness, likely not. :DIn reality, their update process is clearly critically broken. I tried to hit the Start Button and Windows key but they wouldn't summon the Start Menu. That doesn't work! Restarting explorer.exe doesn't seem to fix it. I also tried running the Microsoft Store app with the Run option in Task Manager. Yet again no dice. The system complains that the app cannot be found... What the? Only the Settings app and Task Manager worked for me and that is not saying much. I also tried running updates and doing system file integrity scans to fix this colossal mess, all to no avail. No wonder Microsoft is not actively pushing this disaster out to the masses. The update process from Windows 10 to 11 is totally boogered up!

    EDIT: Being that I like inflicting pain upon myself and I wanted to be doubly sure that it wasn't te process itself that went sour by mere happenstance, I just tried again a second time. Same issue. Here is a photo as proof. It's the oddest thing in the world. Really bizarre.
    Screenshot.jpg

    EDIT 2: A Windows Update fixed it! Thank goodness! Now, to try this thing out!
    Screenshot 2021-10-21 162036.jpg
     
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2021
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  2. sonichedgehog360

    sonichedgehog360 AKA Hifihedgehog Senior Member

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    At this stage, Windows 11 is up and operative and I just had Start11 installed so I can have a close copycat of the Windows 10 Start Menu. However, I just cannot quite put my finger on it, but nothing really strikes me as compelling enough to make me want to stay. This is my first day snap judgement and initial impression that hopefully will change as time goes on. Following a guide online, I figured out how to download and install the Subsystem for Android on a public Windows 11 release without having to switch to the Insider build channel. Android app support too has some caveats where only a small handful of apps from the Amazon Appstore are available and sideloading is not as simple as double clicking on an APK. You have to download the Android Debug Bridge from Google, use it to connect to the virtualized instance of Android in the Subsystem, and then manually install all via command prompt to sideload apps, so it is not a glamorous process nor intended for the faint of heart. Meanwhile, some Android apps inexplicably do not work, some apps complaining they need an Internet connect while others connect to the Internet seamlessly without incident. Honestly, I am not really overly compelled to deploy Windows 11 and I am suspecting I will revisit likely every half year with each new release to see how things have progressed. Honestly, it is not a bad OS but it lacks the focus and purpose that made Windows 10 so attractive. I get more Windows 8 vibes and less ME vibes. Dare I mention they have removed integral legacy features like toolbars on the taskbar (as a result, BatteryBar Pro doesn’t work any more) too besides the iconic Windows 10 Start Menu. Given the fact, though, that the initial upgrade was totally broken (confirmed twice!) and requires an update just to fix the issue where the Windows 10 taskbar remains after the upgrade and no Start Menu will appear, I cannot recommend it. This is a public beta build that is not ready for production or everyday use particularly if upgrading from Windows 10.
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2021
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  3. JoeS

    JoeS I'm all ears Senior Member

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    Noooooo! :eek: That's the first negative of Win11 that impacts me. I love BBP for being able to show me a 'live' power draw as I change brightness or workload. That's it, time to cancel that order of the SLS!
     
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  4. sonichedgehog360

    sonichedgehog360 AKA Hifihedgehog Senior Member

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    The upside is that particular SKU of SLS comes with Win10 installed. ;) At least Microsoft was smart enough to not shove it down people’s throats.
     
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  5. desertlap

    desertlap Pen Pro - Senior Member Senior Member

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    Our company policy for the moment is that we aren't suggesting stable installations of Windows update to 11 yet, as there is no compelling reason for 99% to do so. There is some "hardening" for lack of a better term of security features, that the other 1% might benefit from.

    OTOH, In a carefully managed corporate deployment even that 1% should be protected by their deployment, (active directory, group policies etc.)

    By the same token with new systems (like MS surfaces) there is no need to "go back" to Windows 10, though there is actually an ISO of Windows 10 Pro for Surface Devices.

    That's today though, and we expect, more rapidly than may think, Windows 11 in terms of functionality and security will leave 10 behind. For example the newest version of WideVine which allows secure delivery of higher definition streamed video will require 11 fairly soon for the absolute best quality. You see a hint of that already with what Disney did with the Disney Plus app being the only way currently to get their highest quality streams.

    Finally, I'd point out (though I'm not ready to weigh in yet) that with apps like BBP or others that make alterations to the core UI or functionality (in this case the main shell), there is a belief among a good many MS system engineer types that they are major contributors to the "fragility" of Windows 10 and thus, closing off some of the avenues they use is better for users in aggregate.

    That smells more than a little bit like some of Apple's justifications for how they lock down their various OS's but OTOH as a support person, things like BBP are the first things we look at as possible sources of instability or application conflicts.

    Not to mention that especially outside the US and EU, things that modify the core UI often come with malware/spyware, for example a few years ago there were a couple of apps that "brought back " the windows 7 start menu to 10. In one case that was the vector for a major release of ransomware.

    It's definitely a dilemma for us and still evolving.

    That all being said, we are seeing so far anecdotal evidence that Windows 11 can improve battery life on some systems including the older Surface Pro 7 for instance. Given that in our case, our Surface Pros are used on battery, all day every day in some cases (like me) that could be a valid reason to update.

    We are also seeing some early indications that MS has significantly improved memory management in systems with more than 16GB RAM which often get used for things like hardcore Photoshop or MS excel work.

    So that was more than I started out to say, but my 2 cents for a Friday morning.

    PS: @JoeS I like and use BBP on my personal system, but I have seen the occasional conflict with for example the power management software on the very latest HP Spectres.
     
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  6. Bishop

    Bishop Keeper of Odd Knowledge Senior Member

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    I have to believe M$ will capitalize on cybersecurity concerns as justification for aggressively weeding in the windows garden
     
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  7. desertlap

    desertlap Pen Pro - Senior Member Senior Member

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    Maybe, but I can also see a good point to it.

    FWIW our support staff now spend almost 1/3 of their time dealing with security issues/concerns compared to say 5% three years ago.

    TLDR: speaking selfishly for us, we need all the help we can get! :)
     
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  8. Bishop

    Bishop Keeper of Odd Knowledge Senior Member

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    Believe me, I get it. Most of us are spending wildly to stay ahead of attacks by state actors and their catspaws. If a foreign nation launched missiles or rolled tanks into a company's building in order to seize assets, no one would expect mere commercial enterprises to be able to defend themselves. Use a computer ... . In fairness, some government agencies are stepping up their assistance. The difference is, in WWII, the argument was "fight them there so we don't have to fight them at home." In cyberspace, there's a whole lot of fighting them at home going on. Maybe in cyberspace the difference between here and there is almost meaningless.

    .
     
  9. desertlap

    desertlap Pen Pro - Senior Member Senior Member

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    Agreed, we've seen that to a degree with a couple of our larger government customers, DOD and department of the interior. but to a person our contacts there believe we as a country aren't doing nearly enough and it's still not the priority it should be.

    Not to be too apocalyptic, but one of our consultants believes its a matter of when, not if, one of these breaches will hit a crucial part of the public infrastructure and people will die. Think the power grid in a large northern city during a blizzard, or say the Hoover Dam.
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2021
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  10. daddyfish

    daddyfish Scribbler - Standard Member Senior Member

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    , I like how smooth it already works
    but hopefully more Fdroid store will be added too. Also thought it was funny a 'leak' popped up that Asus is going to make Windows tablets again, might be related to this or Windows 11.
    Also wonder what is eventually going to be best way to run android apps on windows (this vs yourphone vs dex wireless). Should fill the app gap nicely either way for small Windows tablets like the Go.
     
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