Wacom Cintiq alternatives - A closer look

Discussion in 'Hardware' started by whazzup, Dec 14, 2011.

  1. crazycat

    crazycat Scribbler - Standard Member

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    Well you are right. Technology have improved too much today that the differences has become so small. I would say when it come to Cintiq type of device, alternative have gotten to 90% of Wacom's current tech, and already better than the 2013 -2014 UD tech, and that would be enough to make art comfortably. The other 10% should be considered luxury. I can't justify myself paying extra $$ for that 10% , with smaller drawing area and lower resolution.

    And when it come to graphic tablet, without monitor calibrating problem I can't see the differences anymore. I remember in 2007-2008 in high school when I get my first Off-brand Chinese tablet, it was a struggle to get the pen to draw like I wanted to, with wiggle lines, weird pressure curve, and I was still damn happy I actually have one. And I remember many artist in that era use same tablet and still make great art. When I moved to the Bamboo it was such a big difference. Now if we shop around we could buy a small tablet for 20 buck and drawing performance would be on par with that Bamboo. Time move fast.
     
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  2. doobiedoobiedum

    doobiedoobiedum Scribbler - Standard Member Senior Member

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    That is exactly what Rutten will never see or understand.
     
  3. crazycat

    crazycat Scribbler - Standard Member

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    @darkmagistric Apparently Ananta sent a prototype to The verge. This could be more legit than I thought.

    But still we need to remember what happened with the Sefree Apollo which also had a prototype... Back at your own risk I guess.
     
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  4. darkmagistric

    darkmagistric Pen Pro - Senior Member Senior Member

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    Lisa from Mobile Tech got an Apollo Prototype a while back, So I’m firmly proceeding with caution on this one. Frankly if it does come out and the pen use isn’t gimped in some way, I’ll would be fine paying the $600+ retail price in September.
     
  5. doobiedoobiedum

    doobiedoobiedum Scribbler - Standard Member Senior Member

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    XP-Pen 16 Innovator - still 1080p but this tablet is 9mm thin and draws power through a USB-C connection. The alternatives are getting better and better.
     
  6. crazycat

    crazycat Scribbler - Standard Member

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    Nice! Looks like XP-Pen had improved the IAF to be on par with Gaomon. The low IAF is very important to light sketcher like me, and it put a lot less strain on my hand while drawing. The rest is just comestic change, the inner ring looks interesting, but that is all.

    Btw all XP-Pen smaller than 15.6 inch can draw power from an USB connection. I had my UM16/XP-Pen 15.6 run drawing power from an Atom tablet, a small battery pack, and even a phone and it could still works, no big deal.

    My main concern is if XP-Pen have finally appied a standard USB-C port that support single USB-C connection. XP-Pen, Gaomon, Huion had all been using customized USB-C port on their sub 15.6 model. All of them require proprietary 3 in 1 cable to works, and if they are damaged, a standard thunderbolt 3 cable is a no-go. Someone questioned the reason on their forum and the answer is that not enough power can be drawn with normal cable??? It seem like the pin placement is different as well because all test I saw online seem to fail.

    I'm being extra careful with my Gaomon because Gaomon is not selling replacement cable for this model yet. Thankfully the cable looks really big and strong, just need the ports to stay strong.:D
     
  7. darkmagistric

    darkmagistric Pen Pro - Senior Member Senior Member

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    I've been seeing that XP-Pen innovator on my instagram feed as of late...its so aggravating to see so many decent Non-Wacom drawing displays come out one after the other, but still no multi-touch. The innovator looks very nice because of its thinness. Wacom's displays I always felt were unnecessarily fat, hopefully the 3rd parties making that change will influence Wacom to do so.

    As far as the cables go, I was unaware that all these companies made their USB-C connections proprietary. Especially if they don't sell their own replacements, that seems quite short sighted of them. But I can't imagine any of these 15.6 and under sized drawing monitors could sip more then 100w, which is the typical Thunderbolt 3 PD spec. Have you tried a non thunderbolt 3 100w USB-C cable?
     
  8. doobiedoobiedum

    doobiedoobiedum Scribbler - Standard Member Senior Member

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    You remember our discussion a page or so back about Arron Rutten and the Cintiq-alternatives? This video popped up in my feed yesterday. You don't have to watch it as I'll do a precis below -



    Short version: "Wacom Good" - "XP-Pen bad"

    Mid-length version: "Wacom $2500 tablet amazing, Wacom $1500 tablet good" - "XP-Pen $900 tablet poor and the only good thing about it is you get two crappy pens"

    Longer version: "Rutten's friend pays cash for XP-Pen tablet and lends it to Rutten to test - Rutten then trashes XP-Pen that his friend bought with own cash"

    I watched it thinking "how would I feel about it if I was the person who had lent my brand new XP-Pen tablet to Rutten who then produces this video which pretty much tells me I threw $900 on a rubbish product....."
     
  9. crazycat

    crazycat Scribbler - Standard Member

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    @darkmagistric

    I didn't try because I don't have a PC with USB-C, but XP-Pen denied the possibility due to "hardware limitations".

    https://www.xp-pen.com/forum-115.html
    https://www.xp-pen.com/forum-42.html
    A Reddit user tried anyway and it didn't work.

    Both Huion and Gaomon answer in their Q&A that you need HDMI and USB port for their 15.6" monitor to work.

    Huion actually have a 13" 2020 model with single USB-C support to complete with Wacom One, but they had to add an extra USB-C port for that purpose and the device still need another port for power.

    It seem all there companies haven't figured a way to include power, digitizer data and HDMI all in the single device. If you have all data in a single cable, adding another port or separate another USB end for power would still be necessary, (probably otherwise you wouldn't be able to reach the full brightness of the monitor- I had managed to power my XP-pen from something as low power as a phone, but only works with lowest brightness, it shut down if I increase brightness).

    Even Wacom One require the proprietary X cable to work, not single USB-C ( read on Amazon FAQ).Had anyone with Wacom one tried connecting single USB-C without power cable in another port?

    If even Wacom couldn't do it, it could truly be a hardware limitation.

    @doobiedoobiedum May be his friend asked him for honest opinion and that is what he honestly think. We all have different opinions and standard, so just chill and watch Brad's review or something ;).

    His review is still useful to understand the luxury experience of Wacom devices that I wouldn't dream about buying and would never have a chance to try my hand on. We can also see what alternative should still improve on so it help with competition. For example, this comparison of 15.6" monitor bring up solid point about cursor offsets when rotate pen barrel. Look at the beginning of the video.


    The only Wacom devices I have are older UD tabletPC in the 2012-2014 era, and those devices also have that offsets problem (you have to keep your hand in same angle to prevent it). If I didn't watch this review, I wouldn't know Wacom fixed that and still assume that all Wacom also have that problem and it's same issue across EMR devices. We can ignore his recommendation at the end of video but some insight is worth looking to.
     
  10. Marty

    Marty Pen Pro - Senior Member Senior Member

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    It's not a hardware limitation, the upcoming ThinkVision M14t uses a single USB-C connection for power, pen & touch, and display:



    The issue is cost, as a full-spec USB-C controller capable of PD and DP-alt is more expensive than reusing existing controllers from their old USB2 pen displays (over a non-standard USB-C pin layout).

    So basically, Wacom was so 'serious' (read: cheap) about making a budget Cintiq competitor, they even copied the hacked USB-C connection. :p
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2020
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