Thinkpad Helix

Discussion in 'Lenovo (IBM)' started by jhoff80, Jan 6, 2013.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. michaelws

    michaelws Scribbler - Standard Member Senior Member

    Messages:
    783
    Likes Received:
    114
    Trophy Points:
    56
    I was told that the performance difference between the i5 and the i7 would be about 5 percent. If I were doing high resolution painting on the Helix maybe that would be worth the price difference. I just want this for preliminary work. I have a powerful desktop with a Cintiq 21UX for final work. This computer will be something I will take everywhere so I can sketch out my ideas wherever I find myself. The battery life of the Helix tablet is close to 5 hours and I have a portable battery, that I hope will be compatible, and that should give me another 4 or 5 hours.
     
  2. brokenlax

    brokenlax Pen Pal - Newbie

    Messages:
    36
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    15
    There are zero complaints of the 700t throttling, and if it does then you can expect the Helix to follow as that must be some regulation recommended by Intel.

    Windows 8 hardly use a gig on both of my desktops. Your picture really proves nothing other than that acrobat is really bloated. (And who uses that nowadays? I guess there are no good alternatives on osx)

    Really I can open up all of the programs that i regularly use all at once to prove that I need a certain amount of RAM, but I know I would be lying to myself just to make a situational point.

    On the go I would most likely have one or two applications open to conserve battery life and that's about it, and that all together I highly doubt would consume more than 4gb. And for those large documents the page file exists for a reason - and programs such as photoshop use it extremely well.

    Like I said if you think you will need more than 4gb then more power to you. I just find it amusing that most laptop users nowadays claim they need more RAM than their desktop counterparts. I guess it's just from marketing where the most technological illiterate grandma will ask how much ram a computer has thinking that's the determining factor for performance - and then she somehow ends up with an apu or an celeron with 16GB of RAM.

    ------

    But anyways. I heard that they recently removed the MicroSD slot from the Helix and that they reduced the pressure sensitivity from 1024 to 256. Can anyone confirm? If so then there would be no point looking forward to this.
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2013
  3. Steve B

    Steve B Moderator Moderator

    Messages:
    3,378
    Likes Received:
    563
    Trophy Points:
    181
    microSD has been very much discussed, and looks to be removed.

    256 levels of pressure is probably true as well, as that's what basically ALL the tablets really have. It's the basic playing field for all Wacom enabled tablets. It doesn't, to me, seem like any sort of deal breaker, personally, but I suppose the microSD might be to some.

    But hey, if you need 1024 levels of pressure, more power to you. I just find it amusing that some people claim they need 1024 levels of pressure to get any work done. It's really just a marketing gimmick. ;)

    Different strokes for different folks, ya know?
     
  4. brokenlax

    brokenlax Pen Pal - Newbie

    Messages:
    36
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    15
    Exactly, we're in glorious land of the free after all - except in this case it's extremely perceivable for any artists worth their salt vs general technological ineptitude.
     
  5. e-schreiber

    e-schreiber ƒ(x) / fashion Senior Member

    Messages:
    2,629
    Likes Received:
    59
    Trophy Points:
    66
    According to the WEI scores submitted to the Benchmark thread, the GPU in the Ativ 700T underperforms when compared to the GPU on other i5-3317U tablets. It's lower by about 1.0 points (4.5 vs 5.5). Either Samsung has put some throttling mechanism in place on the 700T, or that's just a matter of immature GPU drivers. If anyone is getting better WEI-Gfx scores on the 700T, please let me know.




    Regarding the 8Gb-RAM issue, I think that's usually overkill. Unless the user constantly works with huge images on Photoshop and tends to create dozens and dozens of layers for those images. And even for intense Photoshop users, the Pagefile on SSDs can probably do a great job at speeding up memory-heavy tasks. Some people out there have 3 browser windows opened and 30 tabs in each window. I don't know why the heck they do that, but they "might" benefit from 8Gb too....Who knows? I have 6Gb on my TM2 and I have never used more than 4Gb of its memory -- even though I have turned off Pagefiling completely. I can certainly see why OEMs would limit their systems to 4Gb as that much should be enough for the vast majority of people out there. Instead of complaining about the 4Gb-limit, we should complain about the lack of USB ports and SD Card slots in some tablets. Also, I think that all those Ivy Bridge tablets should have removable batteries or an option for bigger batteries!

    And the point about Acrobat is interesting. That thing has always been a disease-infested elephant! I dropped it at the very same day I dropped Norton. A decade ago. Acrobat is a liability!
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 18, 2015
  6. FenderP

    FenderP Scribbler - Standard Member

    Messages:
    257
    Likes Received:
    81
    Trophy Points:
    41
    I run VMs - and usually quite a lot of them. 8GB is not nearly enough. I need a laptop that is 4lbs or less and is pretty powerful. CPU is not my bottleneck (but there *is* a difference). Anything less than 16GB severely limits what I can do. I have run ULV chips for years with more memory. Heck, the Vaio Duo 11 I'm running now with 8GB of memory and the i7 is arguably as fast as my Panasonic J10 (10.1" full notebook under 3lb with real i7, not ULV) in nearly every way but it doesn't have 16GB of RAM like the Panasonic. So I can do very limited demos and no way I can run training on an 8GB laptop. Just isn't possible for me. If they made 2 x 16GB sticks for 32GB (not 4 x 8), I'd buy 'em.

    So for me RAM and disk speed are the two limiting factors for me when it comes to performance.

    And since I present, having a real VGA (not something I need to convert like HDMI --> VGA) is crucial.

    If the Vaio Duo had 16GB of RAM, I could retire the J10. But I can't.

    The Surface Pro would fail for me on all levels. I think it could be a nice PPT machine for someone who didn't need to do any kind of demos. I like the size and even the form factor, but as a laptop replacement for someone like me? Useless.

    I was hoping the Helix had user upgradeable RAM and SSD, but alas, no. I'll stick the Duo.
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2013
  7. brokenlax

    brokenlax Pen Pal - Newbie

    Messages:
    36
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    15
    Well the duo 11 is really marketed as an ultrabook and not exactly a tablet, so it's not at all comparable to REAL tablets such as the Surface Pro or the Helix; I mean the thing weights 3lbs after all.

    I don't know what field of work you're in that requires running vms on mobile devices, but you can most definitely do it more efficiently on a real mobile workstation such as a clevo and the likes. If the duo 11 is working for you then that's excellent. But theoretically if I wanted to to run vms on the go the ulv processors would be my last choice, lol. But yes, I understand that if you're running virtual machines then ram will be a significant factor (but cpu speed more so).
     
  8. FenderP

    FenderP Scribbler - Standard Member

    Messages:
    257
    Likes Received:
    81
    Trophy Points:
    41
    That's why I still use the J10. The Duo cuts it for simple things. But in the sub-4lb category, finding a machine that has the ability to have 16GB of RAM and great battery life is few and far between. I never looked at the Duo as a full replacement for the J10, but if Sony hadn't soldered RAM onto the motherboard ... arg. Sony does market the Duo as a hybrid and trumps up the tablet functionality. Much like Lenovo is doing something similar with the Helix. The big difference is the Helix screen can become its own tablet, whereas with the Duo you just slide it down to be just a tablet. You can't detach "the dock" per se.

    I disagree about the Helix - since it's being sold with the dock and many will use it that way, it's basically a Duo competitor in the ultrabook space. It's not like you can just buy the tablet part. Same size, same screen resolution, same tech specs - just slightly differen form factor. The Helix in ultrabook format weighs more than the Duo. I would have swapped the Duo for the Helix if Lenovo had supported 16GB of RAM.

    And as someone who has used VMs on ULV chips going back to the Sony U70P, I can tell you CPU is not an issue. It's RAM, disk space, and disk speed for my needs. Panasonic with the J10 (now discontinued), SX2/NX2 (Japan models only), and the x230 are really it for the most part. I've never been a big ThinkPad fan (IBM or Lenovo), but I would have given the Helix a shot if it had better specs.
     
  9. brokenlax

    brokenlax Pen Pal - Newbie

    Messages:
    36
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    15
    I've looked at the Duo and after a few minutes I decided it wasn't for me, simply because it is NOT a tablet and the thing weighted almost 3lbs. It has a ntrig digitizer and a not so stellar battery life when compared to the Helix in convertible mode. (5 hours vs 9 to 10) There's also a sheet battery for the Duo, but that cost $130 and adds more weight and thickness.

    I stand by my point that although similar, people who are looking for Windows 8 tablets in general to replace their laptop and tablet won't seriously consider the Duo, because it is just an ultrabook with some extra features.
     
  10. e-schreiber

    e-schreiber ƒ(x) / fashion Senior Member

    Messages:
    2,629
    Likes Received:
    59
    Trophy Points:
    66
    I think the Vaio Duo (and convertibles in general) can work well for those people who need a laptop much more than they need a tablet. For example, people would use the Duo on "laptop mode" 90% of the time and only rarely switch to "tablet mode". For those people, having a "tablet mode" that they can use once in a blue moon is a bonus. People who need a lot of horsepower, can also benefit from convertibles as they tend to have beefier configurations. However, that will change in the future as we'll eventually see the emergence of speedy detachables like the Lenovo Helix.

    On the other hand, people who do not need a lot of horsepower and will use tablet mode more than 10% of the time should really consider a detachable in order to avoid having to hold the extra weight of the keyboard so often.
     
Loading...
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page