Surface Studio / Studio 2 Discussion Thread

Discussion in 'Microsoft' started by kvoram, Oct 26, 2016.

  1. Steve S

    Steve S Pen Pro - Senior Member Super Moderator

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    <<...the backwards bent that your picture shows, will be way less acute (literally it will be obtuse angled if you just reverse it, which is quite easy thanks to the reversible design of the jack...>>

    ...Seriously. Didn't I just say this...?!??
     
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  2. siddhartth

    siddhartth Scribbler - Standard Member Senior Member

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    that was the first thing that came to my mind, when i saw the Asian lady pick up the dial from the table and onto the display. because sure as hell there are no tempered glass protectors as large as 28".
    • but then i thought you can jus keep the Surface dial upside down on the table. and use the rubber side only when on the display. cover the surface dial with an upside down tumbler again.
    • and keep your surface studio covered with a giant plastic sheet.

    for those who want to use the dial on the surface pro or the Surfacebook,
    • Microsoft can just integrate a clicky touch glass dial surrounded by a colour OLED ring. one finger to scroll, two fingers to rotate. options that you see on screen will be visible on the oled ring on the keyboard.
    • OR ALTERNATIVELY, Should just use a small Tupperware so that the bag grime and lint doesn't stick to the rubber. i am sure Microsoft could have come up with an elegant solution than Tupperware, but they didn't care. i guess they are 90% sure that Surfacebook and surface pro 4 users will never but it. if market research indicated that its not the case, then we might see a solution in future from Microsoft itself.
    • or if a stylish glove like solution with clicky finger tips was possible, then it would have been really cool.
    • or we are worried unnecessarily, Gorilla glass can take alot. an AIO device has a max life expectancy of 3 years any way.
    When and where? I don't understand. you mean you mentioned the point somewhere else?
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2016
  3. Steve S

    Steve S Pen Pro - Senior Member Super Moderator

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    <<...When and where? I don't understand...>>

    See Post #392. It's 4 pages back. This discussion thread is moving very fast, so keeping up with the discussion takes time, but is important...
     
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  4. siddhartth

    siddhartth Scribbler - Standard Member Senior Member

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    thanks i just saw it. i guess in line character of the tread makes it hard to follow. that's why services like Disqus are so popular, there you can make sub thread. but they don't have spoiler and other text formatting features.

    anyways what are your thoughts about solutions of the dirt and sand sticking to surface dial rubber bottom?
    Tupperware VS cleaning obsessive compulsively vs keyboard integration.
     
  5. Marty

    Marty Pen Pro - Senior Member Senior Member

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    Thank you for your interesting account of your IPP vs SP4 purchasing decision.

    But as for describing my own thought process, I do care about inking—greatly.

    If you look at my posting history, I have discussed ad nauseam the benefits of hover responsiveness and hover precision in creative workflows, of sampling fidelity in handwriting, and overall hardware performance consistency in contributing to the "smoothness" of drawing.

    For other artists, the major issue is diagonal jitter (which by reports, happens to be greatly improved on the Studio).

    I think you are unfairly characterizing "inkers vs non-inker". Every artist has their own nuanced set of criteria.

    For me, I appreciate the technological engineering put into a device. For the Z Canvas, this was the amazing thermal design. For the Studio, it is the refinement of the display stack.

    These are engineering achievements that are literally unmatched in the industry and are not just gimmicks: they impact every single task and interaction you perform on the device.

    The premium price tags are a reflection of that design effort and functional benefit.
     
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  6. siddhartth

    siddhartth Scribbler - Standard Member Senior Member

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    I am not dividing artists into - inkers & non inkers.
    I believe all pen based artists care about inking.
    I believe graphic ink based artists are a subset of graphic creatives, other graphic creatives are non inkers - Video/photo editors, magazine publishers, architects. They usually like pen as a precision tool for other purposes than free form drawing and lettering.

    And then graphic ink artists are further divided into - light handed ones, heavy handed ones.
    Now, it's the heavy handed graphic ink artists along with the non inking graphic creatives (Photo/video/architects/engineer/sculptors) combined together, who form the majority of creatives of graphic arts). And to this majority the Surface studio is targeting. So, if one is in that majority group that @jnjroach describes as the 95%, you are in for a treat with Surface Studio. Surface studio will replace every iMac from every editors desk who can afford it It's a great development for Graphic artists as a whole. But it's not the device for every inker.


    But if you are a light handed artist like @thatcomicsguy and @Shogmaster , your time hasn't come yet.

    and this us talking about inkers who do graphic arts, there is a considerable number of digital inkers who do not create knowledge not art, teachers, professors, journalists, students, researchers, there inking is not about art, it's about lettering. these letterers can again be light handed or heavy handed.@Mesosphere @dstrauss too are fellow letterers.

    Now, for light handed letterers there's no windows machines made for these. Galaxy Note is not the right size and smooth plastic nib doesn't help. Apple is right size but doesn't have full featured software of high academic/professional value. These people can live with jitter and live without any pressure sensitivity at all. this is the easiest to please crowd. Still no machine for them has been made yet. These people have only three criteria - no IAF and friction control, no latency. Surface pro 4, has friction control but lacks in other 2 things. I belong to this Category.

    But Calligraphers are that most demanding minority, with requirements so demanding that there are almost no mobility devices for them. calligraphers are invariably -
    • light handed thus want no IAF at all. (Only Cintiq, Apple Pencil provides it- Apple being the best in class)
    • Want extremely controllable pressure level curves especially at lower pressures. (NTrig, Apple all have problems with lower pressure curves)
    • they also don't tolerate jitter (NTrig, Wacom AES, Apple- all have a bit of jitter to variable degrees)
    • they also prefer some friction control (both Wacom and NTrig offer it)
    • 0 latency tolerance
    For majority of these even old Cintiqs are not enough. but that's going to change with the new cintiqs which are perfect for them. Few have transitioned to become pen-masters in the digital realm.

    but still, even the 13 inch mobile studio pro is not a mobility devices, it's still bulky and large. So, these guys have no option but to capture their ideas on a Galaxy note phone or a real paper, and redo them on their New cintiq.

    perhaps a venn diagram would have made sense.

    Because things like,
    • 0 gram weight IAF,
    • imperceptible latency
    • friction tips
    which are a given in natural media, are yet to become universal in tablet PC arena. Many light handed non artistic letters stick to pen and paper despite technology has achieved what is requisite. At least calligraphers have their new Cintiqs now. We light handed hand writers have nothing. iPadminiPRO and Onenote iOS is our only hope. We cannot justify buying and lugging around Cintiqs for meetings and lectures purposes. frustration is this, with pencil and Surfacepro 4 combined this can be achieved technologically very easily in a month. but their digitizers have different protocols.
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2016
  7. thatcomicsguy

    thatcomicsguy Pen Pro - Senior Member Senior Member

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    If being portable isn't an issue, then I don't really see why anybody would choose a self-contained tablet which cannot be upgraded. -Unless, I suppose, you really like working from the couch. :)

    Anyway, while it sounds like your primary concern is horsepower, personally, I would make the decision based on screen size. The Surface Studio looks like a fantastic machine to work on for video and music editing. A 13" screen would give me serious neck cramps and squinty eyes.

    I work regularly on a 15.6" 1080p screen these days, and while it is passable, I still find it very satisfying to bring my work home to the big Cintiq in order to properly see what I'm doing.
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2016
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  8. kvoram

    kvoram Scribbler - Standard Member Senior Member

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  9. Marty

    Marty Pen Pro - Senior Member Senior Member

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    I found this recent interview with Apple directors about the future of Mac to be telling:

    (CNET)
    "It’s not because Apple can’t make a touchscreen Mac. It’s because Apple decided a touchscreen on a Mac wasn’t “particularly useful,”
    —Jonathan Ive

    “We did spend a great deal of time looking at this a number of years ago and came to the conclusion that to make the best personal computer, you can’t try to turn MacOS into an iPhone,”
    —Phil Schiller

    So there you have it, straight from the heads of Apple Design and Marketing; there will be no touchscreen iMac, no answer to the Suface Studio.

    MS threw down the gauntlet and Apple has declined...

    I know there will still be the diehard Mac users out there, but seriously, how do you spin this into something positive for creative professionals?
     
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2016
  10. Azzart

    Azzart Late night illustrator Senior Member

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    Today I dared making a video of myself where I try to explain in my rusty English -and the iPhone 5s internal microphone only makes things worse- my current ideal workflow while using a touch&pen tablet display with Photoshop:



    You can understand how much I'm waiting to get my hands on this machine then...
    And you can also start making fun of me after watching. :D
     
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