Surface Pro X Discussion Thread (October 2019)

Discussion in 'Microsoft' started by JoeS, Oct 2, 2019.

  1. neongolden

    neongolden Scribbler - Standard Member

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    Sadly I can verify I'm having it with the Slim Pen. :(. It behaves exactly as he reports with a smooth curve only happening when my palm is off the screen. As far as determining if it's hardware related, it's hard to tell from the Reddit thread. I'm debating whether to go to the MS store today...
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2020
  2. neongolden

    neongolden Scribbler - Standard Member

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    Well, good lord... I'm not having an easy time replicating the issue in CSP, using an india ink brush. I seem to be getting normal strokes right now whether the palm is on or off. Granted, I decided to crank the stabilization up, so maybe between that and customizing my pressure curve has basically nullified it.

    Could it be that Surface app is just some sort of jank legacy product? It's actually freezing up on me a lot when I go to run the test that TabletPro is doing, to where I have to constantly close and restart it. It could be an x86 thing. The guy on Reddit was using ArtRage to demonstrate the problem but I can't lie to you, I don't have time to go install and bother with it.

    So I guess what I'm saying is I'm out of energy and tabling it indefinitely, especially when I have 2 years of warranty.

    I've still been procrastinating on getting a ShadowPC to complement the SPX. I know how ridiculous this sounds but I'm kind of hung up on having to run the client in x86. I asked a guy on Reddit about how it impacts the battery life but he just gave me the usual 6-7 hours answer and mentioned I can use fast charge. I could tell he didn't care and he's probably right. I just don't like the idea of a streaming client, as opposed to full fledged app, still eating my battery like that.

    I have this interest in the quickest path to only running ARM64 apps in a typical usage session. Once Fresco comes out, it will theoretically be possible for me (lol), but I don't know if I can stand paying $10/month for it. My opinion is that we should be able to pay around $50-75 to have a permanent license.
     
  3. neongolden

    neongolden Scribbler - Standard Member

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    FWIW, I don't think I've had the issues mentioned a few pages back. I definitely haven't had it randomly go to sleep and I would be exchanging it in short order if that continued to persistently happen. There may have been occasions where, upon wakeup, the brightness level was not in sync with the meter, but merely adjusting it would put it back in sync, but I'm not actually sure if that is what I saw.

    A few annoying but acceptable things that have happened is failure for it to go to sleep when folding it into the typecover. I developed a habit of peering down that small opening at the bottom of the typecover to confirm the screen turned off. Sometimes, on wakeup with the typecover attached, the screen will be locked into portrait mode, and I'll have to pull the typecover off to get back to landscape.
     
  4. jhoff80

    jhoff80 Pen Pro - Senior Member Senior Member

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    In the interest of full disclosure, at least one of the issues I identified earlier is apparently on me. PSR (problem steps recorder) not being installed and causing issues in Feedback Hub? Is apparently because it's an optional feature now that at some point I was overzealous and uninstalled. ‍:oops:

    I mean, maybe the messaging the OS gives me should be a little more clear on that one... but yeah, 100% my own fault.
     
  5. neongolden

    neongolden Scribbler - Standard Member

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    Can you guys go ahead and tell me I was smoking the good stuff regarding the top bezel? TPCreview always providing that free psychiatric counseling.

    Top bezel: https://i.postimg.cc/FH2xKy6w/IMG-20200307-202646.jpg

    Side bezel for comparison: https://i.postimg.cc/CKcLN7VQ/IMG-20200307-202708.jpg

    You can see particles trapped and I would be more wary of water droplets falling there vs other sides, but I've had to take it into light rain before, my hands covering the side ports, and nothing happened to it. I really don't want to spend time and resources going up there and hassling them for this. If I could verify for sure that the staircasing was hurting my work, that would be one thing, but since I can't, and everything else about this slate has been good, I want to assume one of the recent updates caused it and it will be ironed out in time.

    Yeah I gotta let this go. Still would have been intensely curious to try their display units...
     
  6. jnjroach

    jnjroach Technology Strategist Super Moderator

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  7. Steve S

    Steve S Pen Pro - Senior Member Super Moderator

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    <<...I just had to ask Steve or any others could do a pen test in the Surface app like at 5:18 in this video...>>

    @neongolden : OK. Watched the video and checked some things on my Pro 7.
    1. Fit of my screen is tight and flush around all four edges. No gaps.
    2. My Pro 7 has never overheated as far as I am aware but I also don't play many games on it as I have other, much more capable, platforms if I want to do that.
    3. Now the weird part. Using the Slim Pen, I see staircasing if I use the pen pressure utility in the Surface app. But when I draw in the Whiteboard app, with the pen set to produce the same fat line width, I see no staircasing when my palm is down (or up). I have no idea why this would be. I'll try the Raphael 5 pen, just in case, sometime tomorrow.
     
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  8. Steve S

    Steve S Pen Pro - Senior Member Super Moderator

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    @neongolden : A follow-up to last night's post. I have now completed a look at my Pro X and tried it with four pens (Surface Slim Pen, Surface Standard Pen, Raphael 5 Pen and Bamboo Plus Ink Pen):
    1. My Pro X screen has a narrow, uniform gap on the top edge between the edge of the screen and the edge of the case. The width of the gap is less than the thickness of a typical business card. The bottom of the gap is closed; I can see no interior components through it. The surface of my screen is level with the edge of the case. The other three edges of the screen are flush and have no gapping. Given typical manufacturing tolerances, I do not think the gap represents a defect; I just think the fit tolerance may have simply been a tad more generous than we're used to seeing.
    2. No overheating problems.
    3. The pen results continue to be a little weird:
      • The Slim Pen results were largely the same as those reported above for the Pro 7. However, after carefully pressing and releasing the pen nib many times in the pen pressure utility, I think I saw very subtle staircasing even with my palm off the screen! With my palm on the screen, the staircasing was obvious but, again, I was unable to see any obvious effects when I used the pen in the Whiteboard app.
      • The Standard Pen results were essentially the same as the Slim Pen results
      • The Raphael 5 Pen results were interesting. The Raphael 5 provides much better and easier control of the pressure curve. The difference between it and the Surface pens was pretty stark! Again, I saw subtle hints of staircasing in the pen pressure utility with my palm up off the screen and much more obvious staircasing with my palm down on the screen. However, again, when I went to the Whiteboard app, I was hard pressed to see any noticeable difference between palm up and palm down. I thought there might have been some barely noticeable staircasing on one or two of the lines with palm down, but it could have equally been the steadiness (or unsteadiness) of my hand. I drew many lines with the Raphael 5 but could not produce one that showed "obvious" staircasing such as those on the video...
      • The Bamboo Ink Plus Pen, compared to the other pens here, was simply awful! It took so much initial activating force on the nib that, when the pen started inking, the resulting line was already too heavy (fat) to show anything meaningful. I really don't use the Ink Plus, so perhaps the internal mechanism has stiffened up for lack of regular use, or perhaps it really isn't a very good pen. Either way, I couldn't get any meaningful lines on Whiteboard.
    I hope this helps you decide what to do. For myself, if I can't see any obvious staircasing when I'm drawing then I'm happy and I don't care very much what the behavior looks like on the pen pressure utility...
     
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  9. neongolden

    neongolden Scribbler - Standard Member

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    Thanks a bunch for getting back to me on both issues! I believe that actually describes my top bezel as well in the end, so I'm going to say everything's fine. I never thought to try Whiteboard; I'm having a hard time telling a difference with the Slim Pen as well.

    Maybe what is occurring with the pen utility has to do with essentially not keeping up with changes to the MPP. For instance, the calibration tool is still there, but if you go to try to use it on the SPX, you'll be blocked, and that's fine because the calibration out of the box has been uncanny in my experience. They've gone "post-calibration," just like the iPad Pro as far as I know. I'm assuming that Surface app may have been written as far back as the Pro 4, so.....

    As for me trying to connect that bezel difference with an offset cursor, I think that's another misread. I did more testing on the other extreme edges this morning and I was able to confuse the cursor a little on the bottom as well. It could be a small side effect of the introduction of tilt functionality, since I believe in the early days of Ntrig, like on the Z Canvas, I want to say it was always spot-on no matter how far to the edge you took it, but it has been at least a few years at this point.
     
  10. JoeS

    JoeS I'm all ears Senior Member

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    Question to my fellow WOA users, when you go to the MS Edge page and hit Download for Windows 10, what version are you getting? I'm still on Edge Canary, and I'd like to switch to a more stable build, but as usual it is unclear which build supports ARM64.
     
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