Surface Pro X Discussion Thread (October 2019)

Discussion in 'Microsoft' started by JoeS, Oct 2, 2019.

  1. Bishop

    Bishop Keeper of Odd Knowledge Senior Member

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    Ahh, which means the litigation is about to begin.

    .
     
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  2. jhoff80

    jhoff80 Pen Pro - Senior Member Senior Member

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    OneDrive native ARM64 beta is now available. I've now got zero non-native processes in my daily use (excluding Office which has native parts and emulated parts).

    https://techcommunity.microsoft.com...rm-devices-now-in-public-preview/ba-p/3031668

    (Note, there are two other reasons why I don't need to use emulation day-to-day anymore - my newer company doesn't use Cisco AnyConnect which despite being ARM64 still had some emulated components, and I disabled the service which is used for the Dolby audio processing / equalization).
     
  3. desertlap

    desertlap Pen Pro - Senior Member Senior Member

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  4. Bishop

    Bishop Keeper of Odd Knowledge Senior Member

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    someone here started this line of reasoning: MS only does proof of concept in hardware. Whether it is lack of vision, will or culture it never sees product lines through to commodity status - surface tablets and mice being exceptions.
     
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  5. desertlap

    desertlap Pen Pro - Senior Member Senior Member

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    I think there is more than a bit of truth to that. If you go all the way back to the announcement/launch original Surface RT and Surface Pro, MS at the time took great pains to explain that they weren't trying to compete with their OEM partners, but instead were trying to showcase Windows and extend the hardware eco system.

    And if that really was the case, I think it was a sucess as the rise of 2 in 1's and even Intel's efforts such as EVO are a response to that.
     
  6. dellaster

    dellaster Creatively Talentless Senior Member

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    From the article:
    Nailed it.
     
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  7. dstrauss

    dstrauss Comic Relief Senior Member

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    I'm usually don't like Segan's commentary but he hit the nail on the head with a 10# sledge hammer. Apple has proven in spades that there needs to be near fusion between silicon and software, and they have a nearly ten year headstart. MS and Intel better just ride out x86 as long as they can.
     
  8. darkmagistric

    darkmagistric Pen Pro - Senior Member Senior Member

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    While I agree mostly....as of late I joined a private Facebook group "Apple M1, M1 Pro & M1 Max". One thing I'm kind of surprised at, is how many issues people are having with the M1 Macs. Hardware, Software, and Build Quality issues galore. Its probably just a pin drop in the bucket in the grand scheme of things given how many overall users they have verus people posting in that group, but when every other post is starting off with "I'm having a problem..", its hard not to take notice.

    I think in the whole Microsoft VS Apple ARM debate, while Apple has undoubtable been more successful, I think the brand perception of Apple is also making people more...'forgiving' towards their faults, where they wouldn't be a Windows device.
     
  9. desertlap

    desertlap Pen Pro - Senior Member Senior Member

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    FWIW. I'm not sure that's really indicative either way. Especially in the case of Apple, my admittedly anecdotal experience is that with Apple users, if things are good for the most part you don't hear from them at all. If they do complain and gripe OTOH it's also rooted (unfortunately) in the sense of entitlement/privilege that many Apple owners seem to have.

    From where I sit, what Apple has done with their particular flavor of ARM is unprecedented. But they have apparently been working on their desktop and laptop ARM chips since the release of the iPhone 6. Equally important is the integration of hardware and software that to this point only Apple has/could do.

    Not to mention due both to that control and the much smaller overall user base, they can be much more effective at moving the platform, dev and user bases forward.

    As should be obvious from my previous posts, I'm a big proponent of ARM generally. And I'm 100% sure that if MS got 100% behind both their own custom ARM chip(s) AND produced a truly optimized version of Windows they could be very competitive.

    But to date WOA is hobbled by both an absolutely minimal effort by Qualcomm on the chip side and MS on the OS side.

    The SQ1/2 has just minimal real laptop/desktop types of changes to the Snapdragon 8x platform.

    And I think MS for reasons I can't fathom still seems to be incredibly tentative in genuinely "going all in" on WOA with either their OS or their own apps. I mean good greif, three plus years on, there are still big chunks of both the OS and Office that aren't 100% WOA native.

    I have slight hope that if it's true that Qualcomm's exclusive on WOA is going to expire next year, we might see some significant improvement as other chips such as those from Mediatek and others could come to market.

    Last but not least, it makes it doubly disappointing that they have the Pro X which otherwise stands toe to toe with anything Apple has produced in the category of "beautiful devices". And this is from someone that believed the hype and bought the Pro X on release only to be terribly disappointed with the reality of it.

    OTOH my father is happy with it since I gave it to him, though for all intents and purposes, he uses it as a MS labelled Chromebook. :(
     
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2021
  10. Bishop

    Bishop Keeper of Odd Knowledge Senior Member

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    Well said.

    Admission: I have an SPX OG for 3 basic reasons -
    1. it offered LTE out of the gate
    2. battery life
    3. form factor.
    Two of my use case realities:
    1. For my work flow, I can't tell the difference in performance between SPX OG and any recent Surface (3 through 7, haven't tried 8).
    2. I now only carry it on trips of more than 4 days when I know or suspect I may need to do large scale document management (and I make fewer of those trips now than ever in the last 5 years).
    But focus for a moment on point 2: the capabilities of phones and "true" tablets (e.g. iPad Pro, iPad Mini 6) have grown to the point I don't need a "laptop equivalent" to do 80% of my work and recreational computing (I'm not a gamer).

    As someone who took out a business loan to by a WinBook XL for just over $3,000 in 1997, I didn't see this coming.

    .
     
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2021
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