Surface Pro 7

Discussion in 'Microsoft' started by dstrauss, Jun 25, 2019.

  1. Steve S

    Steve S Pen Pro - Senior Member Super Moderator

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    <<...what road warrior wouldn't want to be relieved of dongle hell...>>

    Well, there is the VAIO SX12:

    SX12.JPG
     
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  2. b52hbuff

    b52hbuff Scribbler - Standard Member

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    Ha! I turn my back to follow other hobbies, and need to find out where you've been. ;)

    I talked about this a while back. One of the reasons I am happily stuck on my SP2017 is that I really appreciate the tablet experience as well as the tight integration with OneNote that isn't possible with the IPP. I love being able to webclip web pages, and send emails to OneNote and send printouts to OneNote. I know they try to make ON a multi-platform program, but there are just so many more convenient ways to dump information from a Win10 machine.

    ...so I'm wondering if you miss your OneNote/Win10 integration?

    I also seem to recall that you had concerns storing information in the cloud. ON/IPP forces you to take notes in the cloud.

    Also curious to know if you use linked audio notes? The amazing ON feature that allows you to "annotate" a recorded speech, as ON syncs your notes to the recorded audio stream. Does ON on IPP do this?

    I see how your old Galaxy would do all of this. The Dell can do all of it, minus the inking support.
     
  3. b52hbuff

    b52hbuff Scribbler - Standard Member

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    I hope you're wrong. If the Surface team births the Centaurus or some other smaller form factor, then the only way it will be a success is if they have software support. As tech enthusiasts, it is easy to get bogged down into the latest hardware specifications. But at the end of the day, my SP2017 is a useful device because of the software that runs on it. Even though UWP has many advantages, Win32 soldiers on (even in the Office Suite), because it allows software developers and their customers to get things done.

    I wouldn't want a device like a Samsung Note that has a proprietary note taking app that may or may not export or interoperate with what I use on my desktop. I want a set of productivity apps that works in a similar way between my tablet, my desktop and my phone. SP2017 is useful because it helps address common functionality between the tablet and desktop.

    I don't want an "Office for Centaurus", supported by the Surface software team that may or may not be compatible with everything else I do. I want the Surface software team focused on making the best firmware possible for Surface to make it a rock solid device. I don't need them working on "one off" software ports to a non-standard device.

    And I also hope it doesn't go thinner. If it does, then they need to do something about battery life. I want a real 12 hour device.
     
  4. dstrauss

    dstrauss Comic Relief Senior Member

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    I am "stretching" my cloud hatred and fear by allowing note syncing through OneDrive between the iPP and my GB12 now. There I do the more esoteric things you noted (and ON/WinPro10 integration), but the handwriting is mostly on the iPP. I realized I didn't like flipping screens (like SB2 and SP6); the HP Folio I had such hopes for overheats when used for a length of time folded over the keyboard, and the Y series processor and UHD 617 are just below average, much less the TB3 not working with TB3 docks.

    I've never synced audio with notes on any version of ON - mostly because clients and courts are very opposed to that for the most part.
     
  5. dstrauss

    dstrauss Comic Relief Senior Member

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    No Thunderbolt 3 support, but a VGA port - really? :confused:
     
  6. b52hbuff

    b52hbuff Scribbler - Standard Member

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    I admit that it is fun to look at specs, but I'm curious how a TB3 port will change your ability to get things done?

    I keep my SP2017 pretty stock to maximize stability. So I don't have a need to be plugging a bunch of peripherals into my USB-A. About the only thing I plug into it are my IronKey secure USB drive and a few/occasional USB drives when I have to exchange something some files with others.

    At home, I connect to my NAS via WiFi. And I connect to my display, keyboard and other peripherals via the Surface Dock connector.

    So long story short, I'm not missing anything due to lack of USB-C. I see your Dell has a USB-C port. In what way does it really help you be more productive?
     
  7. Marty

    Marty Scribbler - Standard Member Senior Member

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    But how could that work with the Windows unified kernel?

    "x86, x64, ARM and ARM64 architectures...The most amazing aspect of all this is that the core of Windows, its kernel, remains virtually unchanged on all these architectures and SKUs. The Windows kernel scales dynamically depending on the architecture and the processor that it’s run on to exploit the full power of the hardware."

    All that it would mean is that those custom tablet features wouldn't have low level API support, or worse, could break depending on future architecture changes to the kernel.

    Without support from the core Windows team, it could end up being even more heartbreaking than the Courier: a bespoke UI for Surface devices could take off—and be swiftly killed off by a change in direction from the Windows team.
     
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  8. darkmagistric

    darkmagistric Scribbler - Standard Member Senior Member

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    I can give you one example, I have both the 2017 core i5/8gb Pro 5 with USB type A and a 2017 core m3/4GB Galaxy Book 10.6 with USB type C.

    I also have a USB powered Lenovo pen/touch monitor.

    To use it with the Pro 5.....it needs to be connected to two USB type A ports. The Pro 5’s Lone port doesn’t cut it. Need to have a 2nd USB port....either a wall charger, connected to the port on the Surface charger, or even a USB battery charger will do.....but it needs two type A connections to work with my Pro 5.

    The Galaxy Book.....(with using a tiny type a to type c adapter) the lone USB-C port is all that is needed to power the same monitor. So already right there.....for USB multi monitor use.....USB-C has a significant advantage.
     
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  9. dstrauss

    dstrauss Comic Relief Senior Member

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    TB3 gets me one connection docking (in this instance with the Dell 240W TB16) for instant connection to my two displayport QHD monitors; 1g Ethernet; USB-A/C 2TB local backup drive; USB-A DVD drive (we still get document productions on DVD, believe it or not); USB-A HP Laserjet printer, and with a port or two left over for thumb drives when necessary. It's really nice to make one connection convenience. PLUS it charges my laptop.

    There's just not enough bandwidth with plain 5gb USB-C.
     
  10. desertlap

    desertlap Scribbler - Standard Member Senior Member

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    If they go this route (and that is a big if) they could do something similar to what Apple is trying with the various frameworks that for example allow the music app to be built once but able to run on MacOS, IOS and iPadOS.

    ARM on windows already has a HAL (hardware abstraction layer) at the chipset level that x86 windows doesn't. That makes it somewhat easier to make more portable apps and has significant security benefits for the OS as well. For instance a USB device based attack is almost impossible on Windows ARM.

    I'm speculating here so take that in to account. I'm also not advocating that approach per se as it has downsides too as anybody who has tried to get various Linux distros to run on some of the more advanced ultrabooks can attest to (secure boot, trusted OS)

    Last but not least and further evidence to why I call MS schizophrenic is that OS group and the devices group are frequently out of sync with future plans (and surface team members have complained about that privately in multiple places)

    I strongly suspect that the latest leak is an attempt by the surface team members to force the OS team's hand. e.g. "look at how well received this was, help us build it"

    PS: one of the unsung benefits of the unified kernel is that it's still highly extensible. My understanding was that was done primarily to make it easier to support new chipsets as they come along, but it also allows a much more custom OS model too. Think Windows CE on steroids
     
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2019
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