Surface Pro 7 Discussion Thread (October 2019)

Discussion in 'Microsoft' started by JoeS, Oct 2, 2019.

  1. Marty

    Marty Pen Pro - Senior Member Senior Member

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    And the witchhunt begins... :D

    @darkmagistric true to your name, the EMR-alots are out for you!
     
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  2. dstrauss

    dstrauss Comic Relief Senior Member

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    OK - biter (or hunter) #2 here - I've only used the slim pen on the SPX in Best Buy, but I didn't like it as much as the Surface Pen, much less Wacom EMR...
     
  3. sonichedgehog360

    sonichedgehog360 AKA Hifihedgehog Senior Member

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    As inspired by my Surface Pro 7 post from last year, imagine with me for a moment a Surface Pro 8 reveal along these lines this year:

    Panos Panay: “I’m so pumped to share with you today for the first time ever...

    “Introducing the Surface Pro 8, featuring the world’s first and fastest 8-core mobile processor of its class fueled by AMD’s revolutionary, industry-leading 7nm Zen 2 technology! At its heart, the Surface Pro 8 uses the same amazing CPU technology as our upcoming Xbox Series X. This tiny processor sips a mere 15 watts of power and offers 90% more performance than our award-winning last generation Surface Pro 7. In fact, the vast majority of (~95%?) desktops and workstations deployed in the field today—some consuming 10 times more power, weighing 10 times as much, and taking up 10 times the volume (or more) like this typical desktop sitting next to me—do not pack the performance punch of this powerhouse tablet. And the amazing features already found in our Surface Pro X like a field-serviceable SSD and ultra-thin bezels are all now here as well.

    “One more thing...

    “Introducing the Xbox Series X-inspired Surface Graphics Engine, powered by next-gen AMD Navi graphics. Dock and link up to your Surface Pro 8 via Thunderbolt 3/USB 4, and play the latest, blockbuster titles on PC in amazing UHD graphics at a fluid 60 fps!"

    Yes, Panos and Surface Team. If Microsoft sold this, I would sell my desktop (yes, even with the ultra-amazing 3950X inside) at the drop of a hat and buy this to converge my tablet, gaming, and computing into one simple, centralized solution.

    Crosspost:
    https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/fm2ywx/idea_surface_pro_8_make_it_great_with_8_featuring/
     
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2020
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  4. dstrauss

    dstrauss Comic Relief Senior Member

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    And when you awaken from your dream, you will hear Panos saying...

    "Screw the Surface Pro, we are ALL IN on Surface Neo and Surface Duo..."

    Sorry, just couldn't resist. But it would be killer if they took your design and FUSED the Surface Pro and Surface Book lines, offering both a Surface Keyboard and Surface Book base as options - only a return to Wacom EMR could exceed that.
     
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  5. sonichedgehog360

    sonichedgehog360 AKA Hifihedgehog Senior Member

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    I thought that for the longest time, but Microsoft’s recent recommitment in Xbox and huge emphasis of the Surface Laptop 3 using the same technology as the Xbox seems like they are making pivoting from Intel to AMD as their premier or luxury-class processor manufacturer. Then I saw this in the recent teaser video of the upcoming changes to Windows 10 and that solidified my stance:

    upload_2020-3-20_23-6-46.png

    It’s not ARM or Intel but AMD who stands at the center of their trio of processor partners. Center is extremely powerful imagery and language in marketing—balance, strength, foundation, and purpose—and that kind of core imagery very much suggests to me that it is AMD, not Intel, who has taken the role as their power player and the star of their show.
     

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  6. darkmagistric

    darkmagistric Pen Pro - Senior Member Senior Member

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    Sadly no...the hover distance it still the same.

    The Slim Pen uses an entirely new nib assembly......and that's what makes it better. The pressure output at the lower end of the pressure curve is much easier to control then earlier Surface Pens.....now the IAF isn't as low as the Pro 4/5 pen with the HB nib.....but despite that sketching with the Slim just feel alot more natural and balanced because of how it handles the lower pressure. Like the normal Pro 5 pen....as much as I thought painting and coloring was ok with it....I hated sketching with it.....the Slim Pen changed that for me.....I even used my Pro 5 instead of my Galaxy Book for my last few life drawing classes. Usually after a few minutes sketching with the Pro 5 pen, I'd hop back over to my Galaxy Book.....but the Slim Pen....I kept with the Pro 5 the whole class.
     
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  7. dstrauss

    dstrauss Comic Relief Senior Member

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    Are the demos at BB defective - because I find the slim pen nib much more slippery on glass than the regular pen nib?
     
  8. dstrauss

    dstrauss Comic Relief Senior Member

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  9. daddyfish

    daddyfish Scribbler - Standard Member

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  10. sonichedgehog360

    sonichedgehog360 AKA Hifihedgehog Senior Member

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    I recently received a replacement Surface Pro 7 and I initially thought my unit was defective because it was not hitting clock speeds past ~1.2 GHz (and not past 600Mhz when the GPU is stressed and inexplicably not past 800-900 MHz when I plug in a USB-C device!) while on battery power after trying numerous driver and update rollbacks and reinstallations. Come to find out, it was not the device but this service, Intel(R) Dynamic Tuning service, that is the culprit as can be seen in this posting. The solution: Running msconfig, going to the Services tab, and disabling "Intel(R) Dynamic Tuning service" seems to do the trick on my i7 Surface Pro 7. It is extremely likely this is now a widespread problem because in discussing this with him, this same behavior had recently been occurring on my father's regularly updated Surface Pro 7 too. As it had turned out, anyway, during my initial troubleshooting loops, I had been monitoring clock speeds, temperature, and power draw but mistakenly only after the system had already booted into the operating system and had been running for some time.

    By chance, I noticed the behavior when I threw up Task Manager immediately at startup and observed the CPU easily hitting the upper 3 GHz range until it would suddenly drop down to 1.2 GHz and stay down there no matter what I threw at it. I then did some searching online and I was happy to find the post by u/remo0o 22 days ago, describing how disabling "Intel(R) Dynamic Tuning service" in msconfig fixes these issues entirely. Why has Intel up and decided to artificially constraint performance so aggressively on battery and why now? My unit at release was never doing this so this obviously is the result of a recent driver change in the Intel Dynamic Tuning service. Here is my guess: competition, starting with the letter A, as in AMD. Maybe Intel's Ice Lake processors aren't quite able to perform well and perform efficiently like AMD's upcoming 7nm mobile processors, none other than Zen 2-based and codename Renoir Ryzen 4000. Perhaps they are trying to sandbag against Ryzen 4000 mobile processors, which, per the recent round of leaks anyway, are hitting easily 10-15 hour battery life with significantly higher performance than Ice Lake. Ultimately, l leave the final conclusion up to you but I would wager dollars to donuts that my guess is on the money.

    ---

    In fact, a word of warning to reviewers of upcoming Ryzen 4000 laptops. There is a tendency among professional reviewers to only test performance on AC power and ignore performance on battery which is an extremely valid use case for laptops. If you are reviewing Ryzen 4000 laptops side by side with Ice Lake ones, make sure to test both the Ryzen 4000 and Ice Lake products' performance side by side on battery and not exclusively on AC power. With these recent changes to the Intel Dynamic Tuning service's algorithm, the way Ice Lake processors could be getting comparable battery life measurements is by sharply reducing performance, to--quite frankly--unbearably, nigh unusable levels. Said differently, they may run alright when there are no power limits on AC power but they may be no match for Ryzen 4000 on battery so keep that in mind.

    Crosspost:
    https://www.reddit.com/r/Surface/comments/fqwyrk/throttling_on_battery_from_intel_dynamic_tuning/?
     
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2020
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