Surface Pro 7+ Discussion Thread (January 2021)

Discussion in 'Microsoft' started by sonichedgehog360, Jan 11, 2021.

  1. desertlap

    desertlap Pen Pro - Senior Member Senior Member

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    Yes the ability to "hot swap" a working drive fully configured from say a machine that has a broken display to a "hot spare" is big plus for some of our customers.

    Even if the broken system is relatively easily repairable, what they will do in that case ,is move the drive to the new system and when the broken one is repaired it just becomes part of the swap pool.

    We have one customer whose employees often work in hostile climates and thus frequently get damaged systems and the addition of removable drives alone was enough for them to temporarily reduce their normal cycle of three year replacements down to two for the next year.

    Now if they would just do it across the entirety of the surface line, we'd consider doing something similar since we have standardized on the go as the base employee system, but also have lots of Pros and Surface books as well (including me).
     
  2. Bronsky

    Bronsky Wait and Hope. Senior Member

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    That would be a big deal for me.
     
  3. instred

    instred Pen Pal - Newbie

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    Plus put a slot for memory upgrade. Hey solder one in but leave a DIMM slot for user upgrades. Think how many they would sell. Stop the bleeding of customers and give us customers a choice!
     
  4. Steve S

    Steve S Pen Pro - Senior Member Super Moderator

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    <<...leave a DIMM slot for user upgrades...>>

    Don't DIMM upgrades have to be symmetrical (same size in both slots)? Or is it simply best to be symmetrical...?
     
  5. Bronsky

    Bronsky Wait and Hope. Senior Member

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    Best. I had 4 and 8 in my last thinkpad.
     
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  6. instred

    instred Pen Pal - Newbie

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    It is better if they are for some applications. So Microsoft needs to lead the party and make 8GB the minimum on any New Windows computer going forward. It really is BS that some systems come with only 4GB. On top of that some of those computers have soldered on RAM. My Android phone has more Ram then some Windows 10 laptops!
     
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  7. sonichedgehog360

    sonichedgehog360 AKA Hifihedgehog Senior Member

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    This is not required. But you only get dual channel speeds (analogous to RAID-0 on storage) across twice the capacity of the lower sized of the two channels. For example, if you added a 8GB RAM stick to a system with 4GB of fixed/soldered memory (8GB stick + 4GB fixed), you would get 8GB of dual channel memory and 4GB of single channel memory (8GB dual channel + 4GB single channel). This can (though not necessarily will) impact performance when your memory usage pushes to outside of the dual channel region of the memory pool.
     
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  8. darkmagistric

    darkmagistric Pen Pro - Senior Member Senior Member

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    I think its beyond pathetic that 4GB is still a thing. Even with the low cost Surface Pro and Go, 4GB is long due to be put out to pasture. I honestly think the only reason 4GB is still an option is because 8GB would be sufficient enough for most users, and if that's the bottom of the barrel, they're would be less incentive to upsell the customers to more expensive models. Even for my uses, the i5/8GB/128GB config is sufficient for my needs.
     
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  9. daddyfish

    daddyfish Scribbler - Standard Member Senior Member

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    , otoh the 4 gb ram models are nice as secondary devices if they drop in prices (which they probably will :D)
     
  10. desertlap

    desertlap Pen Pro - Senior Member Senior Member

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    Some comments from our world on user upgradable memory or disk drives etc.

    The big OEMS have told us repeatedly two things.
    1. Especially as the demand for thinner/lighter laptops continues to be a dominant market driver, they are all looking for ways to cut any and all space and that means things like physical connectors for RAM or SSDS or WiFi cards for that matter. Additionally as you get ever thinner, even structural integrity (Dell XPS is the poster child for this) becomes an increasing issue both in things like resistance to flex, but also spill resistance and even cooling. For instance just the additional "bump" for a RAM connector can impede the airflow significantly.

    2. A couple of years ago HP shared with us that across their consumer product lines (Pavilion, Envy, Specter) where they offered user upgradable RAM or Disk drive options, less than 7% of users actually did so. The only line for HP where there was significant user upgrades was in their Omen gaming systems and even there , it was in the very low teens percentage wise.

    2a. Even in the business world because of the way companies buy in bulk, they overwhelmingly buy one or more "fixed" configurations and those are deployed with the expectation that by the time they might need an upgrade of components, those systems are at the point where they are due to be replaced anyway

    As I mentioned a few posts back, the one exception to this is some companies is where they like an easily replaceable hot swap drive option like in the 7+. But I'd would argue that broadly speaking that is not the case across business generally.

    Even Dell segments their systems where typically only the Precision line and a small subset of Latitudes have upgradable components where as the XPS and Inspiron lines generally don't.

    Our customers, because of the businesses they tend to be in (and why they are a customer of ours) represent an exception because of the nature of where/how they use their systems.

    Sidenote; If anything K12 education is even more "fixed" in that the systems they buy tend to stay that way for the usable life of the system. There is a vocal, but shrinking minority within that group that clamors for this, but it's more for repairability than anything else. And even there companies like Dell are pushing a TCO argument that the money might be better spent on things like a hot swap pool of systems versus all of the resources including manpower involved in attempting to repair a system.

    I'm not trying to make an argument for or against all this, just sharing what we observe.

    PS: I fully acknowledge that there is a bit of a chicken and egg situation here in that possibly more might choose to upgrade the internals if they had the option to do so.
     
    Last edited: Jun 7, 2021
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