Surface Pro (2017) Discussion Thread

Discussion in 'Microsoft' started by spinedoc77, May 21, 2017.

  1. Marty

    Marty Pen Pro - Senior Member Senior Member

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    I'm curious about this too. If you zoom in, I noticed that the sub-pixel distribution has actually changed slightly from the S6 to S8:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Aside from the general increase in dot size (for increased brightness), there also seems to be a more equalized Red and Blue sub-pixel size, suggesting Samsung may have improved the relative decay rate of their blue phosphors.

    I also found this article from mid-2016, suggesting Samsung recently changed their blue sub-pixel process.
     
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  2. dstrauss

    dstrauss Comic Relief Senior Member

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    The bottom line - whether you talk about "burn-in" or "longevity" or any other issue, the real point is that OLED is still a PITA to deal with like the early days of LCD panels...one more issue I don't want to deal with
     
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  3. Steve S

    Steve S Pen Pro - Senior Member Super Moderator

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    <<...Aside from the general increase in dot size (for increased brightness), there also seems to be a more equalized Red and Blue sub-pixel size...>>

    Photographers are also familiar with the effects of color lattice and arrangement from the imaging point of view:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bayer_filter

    [​IMG]

    Note that more recently, alternate lattice arrangements have been developed and examined for how they (better?) stimulate the perception of color!

    (Image courtesy of Wikipedia)
     
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  4. jjsa1985

    jjsa1985 Scribbler - Standard Member

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    I think the takeaway, for me at least, is that the sub pixels on an oled display degrade over time. So regardless of whether a specific color degrades first or not, if you have static ui elements, that area is going to degrade at a different rate to the rest of the screen. And you will be able to notice the difference in a few years. If I had an oled windows device, I would definitely auto hide the task bar.

    P.S. I didn't read the full article because I'm not a premium user.
     
  5. Marty

    Marty Pen Pro - Senior Member Senior Member

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    I did a bit more research to try to find exact lifetime estimates:

    (Technavio - 2015/05)
    "Blue OLEDs have a short life span — about 15,000 hours — compared to LCDs and LED displays, which perform optimally between 55,000 and 66,000 hours.​

    (Electronic Products and Technology - 2016/04)
    "Many of the obstacles to AMOLED development, such as production inefficiencies, yield-rate management issues, higher investment costs and a short lifetime for light emitting materials, were also resolved in 2015, improving the production."​

    (FlatPanelsHD - 2016/06)
    "When we first started manufacturing OLED TVs in 2013, their lifespan was some 36,000 hours," said Lee Byung-chul, Vice president for LG Electronics to Korea Times and continued; "technological development has extended it to 100,000 hours now. This is equal to 30 years, if a user watches our OLED TV for 10 hours a day."

    So it appears the worst-case estimate for OLED lifespan in 2015, was 15,000 hours, which translates into 4.1 years of use at 10 hours daily.

    That number has probably increased significantly for newer OLEDs manufactured in 2016 and later, closing the gap with LCD lifetimes.
     
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  6. jjsa1985

    jjsa1985 Scribbler - Standard Member

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    Thanks for that research. I wonder though whether by lifetime they mean before it dies or working optimally. That first paragraph you quoted is the only one that mentions optimal performance, and that's the one with the lowest numbers. I'm worried about degrading unevenly. But if what the LG guy said is true, it probably wouldn't matter. Anyway, thanks for your research.
     
  7. dstrauss

    dstrauss Comic Relief Senior Member

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    Welllllll...if it really is about lifetime and optimal performance, many of the users on this board won't have to worry about that, as we are all experts and hardware turnover...
     
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  8. Bronsky

    Bronsky Wait and Hope. Senior Member

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    Funny. I was just thinking that I've had my Surface 3 longer than any tablet I've owned and most of the laptops I've owned as well. My phone is coming up on two years and it still performs well. I'll probably keep it for at least another year (absent a catastrophic event:vboops:) or until a decent folding Note is released.
     
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  9. convergent

    convergent Scribbler - Standard Member

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    OK guys... a couple of questions not related to whether OLED is good or bad. o_O

    - I want to get a microSD card for the nSP to use as working storage for Lightroom. My workflow is to do a shoot, copy card to working storage disk, ingest into lightroom, also copy to NAS so I have two copies. Then process photos in LR. Then eventually delete folder in working storage as I need more space since they are on NAS and backed up also. I'm thinking that if I get a good fast 128GB microSD, I can just use it directly in the camera (via adapter) and then insert in nSP and ingest directly. I'm getting the idea that the nSP microSD slot is slower than a USB3 adapter. Ugh. But is it fast enough for what I want to do?

    - Next question is I'm using the nSP in my office in dedicated pen tablet mode while connected to dock, monitor, keyboard, mouse. As I've been penning notes with OneNote App, I've had some problems with it seeing my wrist resting on the lower right corner of the screen, and being a little erratic. Is there a way to adjust this, settings to try, etc.. to get it to stop doing this. The one thing I've figure out is that if I let the pen get close to the screen (so I see the cursor or whatever its called form the pen on the screen) first, then it doesn't seem to have the problem. But, if I'm in OneNote and just penning, can I just tell it to ignore everything but the pen for a period of time?

    Otherwise, my experience so far with the nSP has been pretty good. I've not seen any of the screen light bleed problems others are reporting, and I have a fairly early lot number. I still have problems with Windows Hello... so use the PIN more often than not. Performance has been good, and I've not run out of battery when off the power adapter (but also not been on a travel gig yet... looking now like the second week of July I'll be on some trips).
     
  10. dstrauss

    dstrauss Comic Relief Senior Member

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    Chicken!!!!!!!

    I can see you waiting for Gadot (I mean a WOA Surface 4)...
     
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