Surface Duo Discussion Thread

Discussion in 'Microsoft' started by JoeS, Oct 2, 2019.

  1. JoeS

    JoeS I'm all ears Senior Member

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    I'm not sure I follow the above, but this year was all Apple. A used XS, used iPad, new iWatch 4 LTE. And the Book2 in January, but that's so long ago... Absolutely zero Surface devices for me until they get TB3 or until they hit second-device level pricing. Like.. $500 with keyboard, aka never.
     
  2. dstrauss

    dstrauss Comic Relief Senior Member

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    And by the end of 2020, even though you are right, this will leave Duo as only an enthusiast phone for not supporting 5g, even in major population centers...
     
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  3. dstrauss

    dstrauss Comic Relief Senior Member

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    I was being obtuse as ever - with my ThinkPad X1 Yoga in Lenovo repair hell (14 days and NO progress) I am rethinking my logical and financial refusal to round out my gear kit with a MacOS device...I've got all the rest, same as you...
     
  4. Steve S

    Steve S Pen Pro - Senior Member Super Moderator

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    <<...this will leave Duo as only an enthusiast phone...>>

    ...Did you read the article? That's apparently Microsoft's early expectation and exactly what the author said in closing...!
     
  5. dstrauss

    dstrauss Comic Relief Senior Member

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    I know...that's the disappointment
     
  6. rabilancia

    rabilancia Pen Pal - Newbie

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    I FULLY agree! I volunteer on our City's Communication Advisory Board and I just prepared a theoretical cost projection for the Board. Here is a quick summary. Using these factoids:
    1. From the US Census Bureau: U.S. Cities are Home to 62.7 Percent of the U.S. Population, but Comprise Just 3.5 Percent of Land Area
    2. Dish Network recently announced the installation/deployment of 50,000 5G towers at a total cost to them of $10 billion. That amounts to a whopping $200,000 per 5G tower!
    3. With 5G ranges limited to 200 to 300 feet, 250 to 300 towers per square mile will be required for full coverage.​
    Doing the math, between 130,000 and 140,000 towers will be required to provide coverage to that 62.7% of the population. The allocated investment cost per person living in that 3.5% of the land area will exceed $25,000.

    How is this possible if the carrier is to quickly recover a $25,000 investment for every person (remembering too that not every person will become a subscriber)? Huge numbers. Big promises. I guess that we'll have to wait and see.
     
  7. Steve S

    Steve S Pen Pro - Senior Member Super Moderator

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    <<...Doing the math, between 130,000 and 140,000 towers will be required to provide coverage to that 62.7% of the population...>>

    ...Yikes!

    In addition, one should be mindful of the corresponding increase in the digital microwave background levels (and you were worried about power lines!)...
     
  8. JoeS

    JoeS I'm all ears Senior Member

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    I think you elegantly showed that 5G only makes sense in areas where the number of people significantly exceeds city-averaged population density (forgive the mismatched units.. :) ). Meaning 5G could be useful and economical in open spaces with lots of people, e.g. sports venues, and perhaps a place like Grand Central Station.

    Even for stadiums I have read a single 5G installation cannot reach an entire stadium at once (depending on stadium size), so you might almost as well use Wifi and mitigate signal crowding (?) with more wifi access points. Long story short, getting an expensive 5G compatible phone may prove useful, but likely only in a few isolated instances. At least the part of 5G that uses this high-frequency high bandwidth spectrum, I believe there are other parts as well.

    Phew, didn't mean to write a thesis. Anyway, thanks for the insight @rabilancia !
     
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  9. desertlap

    desertlap Scribbler - Standard Member Senior Member

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    All though the millimeter wave that Verizon especially is trumpeting is getting all the attention , the medium and longer that T-Mobile and Sprint are using will I think have the bigger impact at least in the medium term.

    For one thing, the towers are much cheaper and easier to deploy.
    Two the signal penetration in buildings is much better than MMwave.
    Three, and what people are neglecting to realize is the even the slowest 5G is still generally faster than the best LTE and more reliable to boot.

    In fact the new OnePlus 7T Pro with 5G will support both T-Mobile and Sprint networks. That makes sense from a business perspective, but the bigger albeit more subtle news is that they found a way to put both antennas in the same device, something that has yet to occur with mmwave.

    https://www.pcmag.com/news/371485/oneplus-7t-pro-5g-mclaren-taps-t-mobiles-long-range-5g-netw

    PS: I wouldn't be surprised to see the Duo do the same as well as even a future NEO, though not the first version.

    PPS: These phone names are starting to get ridiculous... OnePlus 7T Pro 5G McLaren Edition... really ?
     
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  10. dstrauss

    dstrauss Comic Relief Senior Member

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    Can't wait for the Google Pixel 5g Pro Penske Edition...
     
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