Surface Book Discussion Thread

Discussion in 'Microsoft' started by DRTigerlilly, Oct 6, 2015.

  1. ikjadoon

    ikjadoon Pen Pal - Newbie

    Messages:
    80
    Likes Received:
    41
    Trophy Points:
    26
    OK, agreed. The Toshiba & Samsung 256GB drives are somewhat similar in current-day write speeds, but don't forget. Sequential write speeds are exactly the speeds that degrade over time as the drive becomes more full. That difference gets even bigger.

    And, also don't forget the 311MB/s drive uses the funky Samsung TLC NAND, which in the PM851 (in the SP3) caused lots of issues and in the 840 EVO caused the largest SSD quality control failure since the days of OCZ:

    https://www.reddit.com/r/Surface/co...re_update_for_surface_pro_3/?ref=search_posts
    http://www.anandtech.com/show/9196/samsung-releases-second-840-evo-fix

    Overall, though, it is currently a very inconsistent experience overall. Did you know the difference between the 128GB and 256GB can be nearly an order of magnitude in write speeds? Yeah, it's currently 7x faster.

    If you have a 128GB Samsung with BitLocker enabled:

    [​IMG]

    If you have a 256GB Toshiba with BitLocker disabled:

    [​IMG]

    For a 1GB file, 7 seconds on the Samsung turn into 1 second on the Toshiba. For 10GB of transfers, you're looking at 1:06 vs 9 seconds. Very noticeable. It's a completely unfair comparison because of the BitLocker status, but I can't find a 128GB owner with BitLocker disabled. But, you get the idea.

    True, it isn't a catastrophic choice; just quite poor for such a premium laptop. As I noted above, it uses TLC NAND--why is budget NAND being used in a premium laptop? And it's Samsung's TLC NAND, of all the choices, the same company and the same NAND that yielded the massive quality control failure where their drives started to lose performance with stale data (hadn't been modified in some time)--you know, like C:\Windows.

    I don't understand their choice. It shouldn't have been for cost, especially not at the prices we're paying. And it if was truly for power consumption (as some have stipulated), why did they rush to NVMe? Plenty of PCIe drives exist that are faster than the PM951 and consume less power.

    And why are there two different drives floating around, with such massive performance differences?

    I wouldn't care about these issues in a $900 gimmick laptop from ASUS. It could use "QLC" that was scrapped together from 10-year-old Sandisk SD cards. But, in the $1500 "ultimate laptop"?

    In my opinion, if Microsoft "gets away" with this sort of component selection, will we be OK if the Surface Book 2 comes with a USB 2.0 port? I mean, it's much faster than USB 1.1 and how many of you are really using all 5Gbps of USB 3.0?

    EDIT: Lisa, thank you so much for the tip about Windows' update and indexing. That cleared up a lot of issues for us at /r/surface on reddit. I totally forgot about those, especially indexing! :(
     
    Mesosphere and alextrela182 like this.
  2. Don1

    Don1 Scribbler - Standard Member

    Messages:
    645
    Likes Received:
    87
    Trophy Points:
    41
    Asus provides much better write speeds in a $400 t300.
     
  3. alextrela182

    alextrela182 Scribbler - Standard Member Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,440
    Likes Received:
    566
    Trophy Points:
    131
     
  4. AmbiDextrose

    AmbiDextrose Scribbler - Standard Member

    Messages:
    210
    Likes Received:
    102
    Trophy Points:
    56
    Good review video, @alextrela182. However, the reviewer (Justice Frangipane) should have used a straight-edge when doing the slow wobbly lines test. I find that if I just use a regular ballpen and try to draw a line VERY slowly, the line wobbles. However, even when I'm trying to ink a peice, I never draw that slowly , not that I've ever tried to measure it in any way (e.g., px/s and px/s^2 or mm/s and mm/s^2).
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2015
  5. dstrauss

    dstrauss Comic Relief Senior Member

    Messages:
    11,220
    Likes Received:
    9,813
    Trophy Points:
    331
    @ikjadoon and @Mesosphere - OK guys - bottom line - in real life work, productivity, regular photo editing (not Vogue or NatGeo), some gaming, does it really make a difference - or are we really talking about Warp 1 vs. Warp 3?
     
  6. Mesosphere

    Mesosphere Geek. Senior Member

    Messages:
    5,315
    Likes Received:
    2,065
    Trophy Points:
    331
    You should have replaced "remember" with "FYI" =) I was not aware of the QC issues - definitely concerning.

    The 256GB Toshiba image isn't showing up, but for it to be 7x faster than the 128 GB Samsung it would have to be ~1113 MB/s. That is much faster than what people have been posting for the Toshiba SB drives.

    Also, my comments were only meant for comparing the two 256GB drives. With SSDs it's my understanding that larger drives are generally faster than smaller ones, and there is also the bit locker difference. It doesn't seem like a fair comparison.

    Still, if there are significant quality control issues to be expected with these Samsung drives. That is a big deal.
     
  7. kruzilla

    kruzilla Scribbler - Standard Member

    Messages:
    237
    Likes Received:
    27
    Trophy Points:
    41
    Here's an artist's quick review with Zbrush and PS. The lag with PS is pretty crazy. Has anyone else's experience been similar?
     
  8. surfaceproartist

    surfaceproartist Scribbler - Standard Member Senior Member

    Messages:
    2,930
    Likes Received:
    1,893
    Trophy Points:
    181
    @kruzilla This behavior may have been fixed with the new drivers released earlier this week. (I no longer have a Surface Book to test). But the workaround is to disable GPU acceleration in Photoshop.
     
  9. kruzilla

    kruzilla Scribbler - Standard Member

    Messages:
    237
    Likes Received:
    27
    Trophy Points:
    41
    Interesting. I would think the GPU would actually make it better but judging by posts I've seen here and elsewhere, that's not the case.
     
  10. surfaceproartist

    surfaceproartist Scribbler - Standard Member Senior Member

    Messages:
    2,930
    Likes Received:
    1,893
    Trophy Points:
    181
    @kruzilla The drivers released with the Surface Book weren't properly optimized for the new hardware, which includes the custom GPU. So far I've only seen Intel graphics updates, nothing from NVidia.
     
Loading...

Share This Page