Intel 7th Gen CPUs On Schedule for Later This Year

Discussion in 'Hardware' started by Steve S, May 31, 2016.

  1. Steve S

    Steve S Pen Pro - Senior Member Super Moderator

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    Uh-oh... This looks bad:

    https://www.neowin.net/news/securit...l-cpus-could-result-in-a-huge-performance-hit

    (Courtesy of NeoWin site)

    ...More:

    https://www.onmsft.com/news/intels-...oft-others-to-apply-performance-slowing-patch

    (Courtesy of OnMSFT site)

    Note the last sentence in the above link. The SEC would likely call this "insider trading," and Krzanich will have some questions to answer...

    ...More details:

    https://liliputing.com/2018/01/pcs-...s-patching-major-intel-cpu-vulnerability.html

    (Courtesy of liliputing site)
     
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  2. sonichedgehog360

    sonichedgehog360 Editor-in-Chief of TechAndTiny Senior Member

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    "[W]e're looking at a ballpark figure of five to 30 per cent slow down, depending on the task and the processor model."

    Translation: AMD Ryzen, unaffected by the security flaw, have just clutched victory since this clears Intel's minor single-core IPC lead in some cases. Looking forward to February and March, AMD Ryzen will continue pushing past Intel with the release of its refresh desktop processors, which are certain to offer a sizeable clock speed boost over the first generation models.



    AC23108A-AB98-4F7A-9F14-CB683C75DAC9.jpeg

    https://twitter.com/bryanlunduke/status/948430797266042880
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2018
  3. Steve S

    Steve S Pen Pro - Senior Member Super Moderator

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    <<...AMD Ryzen, unaffected by the security flaw, have just clutched victory...>>

    ...I'm sure that AMD will probably feel good about this, but I'm thoughtful about the millions of existing Intel desktops, laptops and tablets. If the average performance loss is a few percent, that will be one thing, but if it's double digit percent, that will be something else...
     
  4. sonichedgehog360

    sonichedgehog360 Editor-in-Chief of TechAndTiny Senior Member

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    For the data center and enterprise, SQL databases in one test suite saw a 17-23% drop in performance after the patch was applied to Intel systems. Gaming, on the other hand, appears to be unaffected--note, I say "appears" since Linux gaming performance can be markedly different, especially with OpenGL, where games can be more GPU bound than CPU bound.
     
    Last edited: Jan 4, 2018
  5. Steve S

    Steve S Pen Pro - Senior Member Super Moderator

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    Note that in a new statement, Intel is saying that performance losses will be mitigated over time...
     
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  6. sonichedgehog360

    sonichedgehog360 Editor-in-Chief of TechAndTiny Senior Member

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    For future processors? With driver updates? Through code refactoring just for Intel? I am tending towards the first and third options which I propose, with the third likely not amounting to much since developers aren't necessarily going to dust off old code when future processors will do the job for them absolutely free. Besides, I don't think any number of firmware and driver updates can fix the reality of the requisite cache flushing that is required for this security fix which impacts a decade's worth of Intel processors.

    In clearing the processor cache, the processor now, by default, must go to the high latency main system memory to re-grab data and code thereby adding milliseconds of delay which equates to eons in modern computer systems. Really, no fix can completely negate this problem given the factors of difference between processor cache and main memory latency. Processor cache is awfully important and without processor cache being harnessed to its fullest extent in Intel's entire processor line, we are looking at drastically slower application performance in cache intensive tasks on all Intel processors.

    Something else to keep in mind: Intel already knew this way back in June 2017:

    "But while the public is just being informed about the security problem, tech companies have known about it for months. In fact, Google informed Intel of the vulnerability in June, an Intel representative told Business Insider in a statement.

    "That means Intel was aware of the problem before Krzanich sold off a big chunk of his holdings. Intel's CEO saw a $24 million windfall November 29 through a combination of selling shares he owned outright and exercising stock options.

    "The stock sale raised eyebrows when it was disclosed, primarily because it left Krzanich with just 250,000 shares of Intel stock — the bare minimum the company requires him to hold under his employment agreement."

    Source:
    http://www.businessinsider.com/inte...fter-company-was-informed-of-chip-flaw-2018-1
     
    Last edited: Jan 4, 2018
  7. Steve S

    Steve S Pen Pro - Senior Member Super Moderator

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    <<...For future processors? With driver updates? Through code refactoring just for Intel?..>>

    ...My interpretation is that Intel expects that refined patches will reduce the performance loss, but that some percentage of performance loss will always remain for legacy processors.

    Here is an updated article:

    https://liliputing.com/2018/01/intel-issues-statement-security-vulnerability.html

    (Courtesy of liliputing site)

    "...Intel also says “contrary to some reports, any performance impacts are workload-dependent, and, for the average computer user, should not be significant and will be mitigated over time.”

    That’s actually in keeping with what we noted earlier today: some activities such as gaming seem to be largely unaffected. But as discovered by Phoronix, some tasks, like PostgreSQL and Redis seem to take serious performance hits on a Linux system with the updated version of the Linux Kernel designed to address the security vulnerability.

    So you may or may not notice a big performance hit depending on what it is you’re using your computer for..."
     
  8. Steve S

    Steve S Pen Pro - Senior Member Super Moderator

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  9. Steve S

    Steve S Pen Pro - Senior Member Super Moderator

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    This article from Tom's Hardware has some very interesting language in it (think: statements intended to position to avoid litigation) and the article also argues that performance losses for the average (non-data center) user will be small:

    http://www.tomshardware.com/news/intel-bug-performance-loss-windows,36208.html

    ...and, if you aren't sick of reading about it by now, here's yet another take on the two vulnerabilities and their potential performance impacts. Note that this article makes it clear that Spectre cannot be patched at this time and will remain a threat, albeit a remote one, for now:

    http://www.tomshardware.com/news/meltdown-spectre-exploits-intel-amd-arm-nvidia,36219.html

    (Courtesy of TomsHardware site)
     
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  10. RT545

    RT545 Scribbler - Standard Member

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    https://www.theguardian.com/technol...uter-processor-intel-security-flaws-explainer

    "Spectre affects all modern processors, including those designed by Intel, AMD and ARM, but Meltdown is currently thought only to affect Intel chips manufactured since 1995, with the exception of the Itanium and Atom chips made before 2013."


    Technical info by one of the researchers who discovered the flaws (Jann Horn from Google’s Project Zero team)

    https://googleprojectzero.blogspot.fr/2018/01/reading-privileged-memory-with-side.html

    https://spectreattack.com/spectre.pdf
    https://meltdownattack.com/meltdown.pdf
     
    Last edited: Jan 4, 2018
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