If No Z Canvas 2nd Ed, Is There A Logical Alternative?

Discussion in 'VAIO / Sony' started by Steve S, Jan 30, 2017.

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  1. Marty

    Marty Pen Pro - Senior Member Senior Member

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    So are you gonna buy one before you leave Japan? :p
     
  2. FenderP

    FenderP Scribbler - Standard Member

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    Lol no. Even if I wanted to I couldn't. The 16GB/1TB is a CTO config. The XZ is not released until the 17th anyway, so there is that.
     
  3. kvoram

    kvoram Scribbler - Standard Member Senior Member

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    Looks good overall, the wobble could still be improved. One more thing, I suppose the tablet can be docked the other way round as well, to use it as atablet with base attached?
     
  4. Seggybop

    Seggybop Pen Pal - Newbie

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    Panasonic XZ's USB-C port doesn't support Thunderbolt. It's regular USB 3 in the USB-C form. Overall I don't really see a compelling reason why the XZ would serve as a replacement for the Z Canvas, given that the CPU is drastically weaker and it's still lacking the most requested feature (TB3). XZ seems more appropriate for people who liked the basic concept of the Surface Book but were unhappy with the implementation and don't care about the GPU.
     
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  5. FenderP

    FenderP Scribbler - Standard Member

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    As I was playing with the Z Flip yesterday at Bic, I couldn't help but think they could marry the guts of the ZC with the form factor of the Z Flip. Sure the base would need to be a touch thicker but it's not far fetched. Going from the Z Flip to the XZ, you can see the very different approaches to inking both Vaio and Panasonic took on somewhat similar machines (give or take).

    I didn't try that and won't get the chance since I'm leaving today.

    It's a bit between the SB and what the ZC is. Remember that Panasonic here in Japan makes these machines for business purposes, and they are NOT marketed to the drawing crowd so the design/function/form matches. GPU is not a concern to business folks. I don't care about the GPU in any machine, and yes, the 7600U won't be as powerful as the quad core. I think we can all agree. But the 7600U should be much more equivalent to the now 2+ year old 6567U in the Z and Z Flip. The fan design/cooling system of the XZ is closer to the ZC than anything else I've seen.

    I've run VMs on ULV and Core M procs. I've done it on the ZC and other i7 Us in the past. I'm not worried if I get it (still an if) that it won't run what I need it to. The ZC really does run it better, but I need something with a bit better portability and battery life at this point, and more built in ports. I think that coming up on nearly two years with the ZC having received it in June of 2015 from Japan, it's served me well. I'm on keyboard #2, it's been all around the world and in front of many people as a presentation machine/demo box, but its shortcomings are becoming more glaring to me.

    Keep in mind the Panasonic Let's Note line has generally lagged behind in adoption of things - USB 3, now TB (I was wrong, sorry - I'm human) are examples. Their prior flirtations with pen in the Let's Note line (most notably things like the MX) were not like this at all.It's still a fourth USB port which is helpful when docked. I would bet an update later this year of the XZ will adopt Thunderbolt knowing Panasonic. Business folks generally could care less about the latest and greatest, and the Let's Note line has always taken this approach to a degree. Personally, I could use it but USB 3.1 is still not bad for speed for things like an external hard drive.

    Different strokes and all that. The ZC is/was a no compromises performance beast with its own set of tradeoffs. No one, not even Vaio, seems to be stepping up to the plate and offering something newer that is equivalent.
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2017
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  6. Andrik

    Andrik Pen Pal - Newbie

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    I've read this thread and I am really amazed...
    Why in the world would you want a replacement or 2nd edition of the Canvas?

    Really, the CPU is a powerhouse..there is simply no comparable sized laptop/tablet yet. Yes the CPU is a Haswell generation CPU, three generations old. Current 'competitors' like the surface range all have Ultra low voltage CPU's..they are designed to conserve battery, have only 2 cores and are clocked to run at low frequencies. The Canvas has a real Quadcore CPU designed to deliver uncompromising power. All those ULV processors, even the new ones, don't come close to the Haswell quadcore inside the Canvas.

    Concerning battery life...I have the Canvas and also the Surface pro 3 I7. Battery life is about the same on both devices when you do average stuff like webbrowsing, word processing...The battery life on the canvas is not that bad. If you want better battery life, you clearly don't need the power of the Quadcode CPU because if you do, you would know such power comes with a price batterywise and you would accept that.

    furthermore the Canvas has the Intel iris pro 5200 GPU, which is still an extremely powerful GPU. It compares to a nvidia 650m card and really outclasses all of the current built in Intel gpu's.

    So all I'm saying is...the Canvas is a beast and it will be for some time, so why don't you all just enjoy your maschine instead of looking for a replacement.
     
  7. FenderP

    FenderP Scribbler - Standard Member

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    Because after nearly two years, my needs and requirements have changed. The ZC lacks enough memory (16GB is not enough), the battery life is meh (5 - 6h is not enough), and I need something that works better for travel. It's that simple. It doesn't matter how good the CPU is, and I'll miss it with something ULV that replaces it.

    Also this is just plain wrong
    Being a power user, I know the quad core is not conducive for tons of battery life, and I do agree that the SP is not the best on battery, but I do need more than the ZC gives me. If you are not a road warrior, battery life may not matter and that's cool. I lived with the short battery life since getting it from Japan in June of 2015. I'm pretty qualified to say it not only matters, but on a laptop, everything has to be in balance. Is it the most horrendous battery life ever? No. I'm not saying that, but it barely makes a transcon. Forget about using things like VMs if you want that 5 - 6h.
     
  8. Mr. Boosh

    Mr. Boosh Scribbler - Standard Member Senior Member

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    In today's thread on a hardware enthusiasts forum, some guy with 4 posts telling people they're not enjoying the devices they own and not to look for any alternatives, despite varying use-cases. Got it, thanks Andrik!
     
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  9. RT545

    RT545 Scribbler - Standard Member

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    Don't know what the logical alternative for the Z canvas could be as there is no other quad core tablet indeed, and certainly not any with so good a fan design.

    For the next processor, however, Intel has now released three of the mobile XEON processors (http://ark.intel.com/products/family/97141/Intel-Xeon-Processor-E3-v6-Family) and they seem quite much like the v5 versions (same TDP for comparable designation) only with slightly better frequency, and the latest kabylake versions of the GPUs.

    So now waiting for a logical release of a 7770HQ (with the iris plus upgrade of the iris pro 580 found in 6770HQ) and a release of 35W XEON E3 1565L v6 (with the iris plus upgrade of the iris pro P580 found in XEON E3 1565L v5) as next possible candidate processors for any future quad core design.

    Waiting also, of course, in comparable TDPs (and maybe even lower!) the release in 2H 2017 of the AMD ryzen quad core processors for notebooks.

    If VAIO chose not to continue the Z Canvas, maybe the best thing they could do would be to license their incredible fan design to someone else who could take up the torch (and to another Japanese constructor, why not; Fujitsu, Panasonic, ...). Or maybe they will reconsider, at the end of the year; In any case, any constructor willing to release a quad core tablet (with possible TB3 GPU extensions) still has a potential to hold a great product, useful for many, and extremely competitive in front of the next SB2 (unless the SB2 itself finally goes quad core!).
     
  10. FenderP

    FenderP Scribbler - Standard Member

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    True story: so I'm sitting here using the ZC with a crossover cable to the Skull Canyon NUC (has 32GB in it). I can hear the NUC. The ZC is silent and as cool as a cucumber. That's what I'm going to miss about using the ZC all the time when I transition to another machine. From what I saw, Panasonic did a similar fan design to a degree, but I won't know since I decided not to get it due to the 16GB limitation.

    The ZC and any successor is dead. I think people need to make peace with it. :) I'm hoping they at least update the pen-enabled Z, but even that hasn't happened.
     
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