HP Touchsmart tx2z

Discussion in 'What Tablet PC Should I Buy?' started by adam.mt, Dec 19, 2008.

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  1. SteveyG

    SteveyG Pen Pal - Newbie

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    Hi there, im interested in the touchsmart tx2z, when it eventually comes out in the UK, but the general consensus seems to be that the HP tx series has rubbish build quality and the N-Trig digitizer leaves a lot to be desired.

    I was just wondering what exactly about the build quality is the problem, i mean is it actually a real issue (im thinking bits breaking off in your hand) or is it just that it feels a bit plasticy?

    Also with the N-Trig digitizer, what are the main problems? It seems like HP and N-Trig are really trying to premote the capacitive touch screen and multitouch capabitlties so have they neglected the good old original pen input? I know the pressure sensitivity is not compatable with photoshop and the likes but it im guessing its still compatable with standard tablet programs such as the windows pen input panel and onenote?
    Also to anyone whos used a capacitive touch screen, is is actually a realistc input alternative to the stylus? (I have tried the resistive touchscreens before and you find yourself reaching for something pointy like the end of a pen anyway so you might as well be using the stylus!) I can envisage typing on the on screen keyboard like it was a real keyboard or am i being too optomistic? :p

    Also, if windows 7 is going to focus on multitouch input then a PC like this is surely going to become the norm so purchasing it now would effectively future proof me for a well after the new version windows comes out. This also suggests that if N-Trig becomes a serious competetor to wacom, then programs like photoshop will include support in the future? ... or have i completely got the wrong end of the stick? :p

    Any help would be greatly appreciated :)
     
  2. DRTigerlilly

    DRTigerlilly Tablet Lead Mod (Retired) Super Moderator

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    typing on the screen is optimistic w/ the current keyboard, but 3rd party one's might be better.

    The capacitive screen is fine for the non graphic artist user, but what alot of users are also concerned about, is that in the previous notebook that used the ntrig digitizer, the digitizer was throwing errors, randomly shutting off etc, and users are concerned if those issues exist, especially since no fixes have been released for the other ntrig notebook. (but based on early reports, it seems to be fixed)

    build quality: creaky chassis, fingerprint readers falling off...
    It is consumer level, but for users who've used the professional models there is a noticeable difference. dark, grainy screen w/ poor viewing angles., very reflective screen doesn't hold up well to outdoor or bright fluourescent lights.

    all of that said, if you have the opportunity, you should go into stores and try it for yourself, see what you think about it personally. (hopefully there are some retailers in the UK that carry it or any of the tx's since they're the same chassis. unfortunately you won't be able to test out the ntrig in earlier models)
     
  3. adam.mt

    adam.mt Super Moderator Senior Member

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    I was also interested in the TX2 when it hits the UK in January (but why are there no pre-orders? Perhaps it could mean a longer wait?).

    However, after research I'm now leaning heavily towards the Toshiba Protage M750. It lacks the multi-touch, but still has standard touch - see http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=juleRDMsUls for a demo of it running Windows 7.

    From the video it seems touch input is still as impressive. Users have said it's more sensitive than eg the HP TX2500, thus all it lacks compared to multi-touch is the gestures, which at the moment only amount to zoom in/out and rotate*. (Watch the smaller PiP screen, as the main display is slightly jerky not because of the laptop but because of the capture process - the author warns of this on his website).

    (* Of course multi-touch may get better in the future, eg. allow multiple users to interact, however it's not guaranteed the NTrig tech is actually upto that)

    The pros for the Toshiba compared to the TX2 are:

    - better build quality, more sturdy (don't imagine there's anything greatly wrong with the TX2500/TX2 except they feel a bit plastic; can't imagine bits breaking that easily tbh)

    - 3 year warranty (HP is only 1, and considering users complaining about earlier TX tablets, though supposedly the TX2500/TX2 are better, perhaps a good warranty is wise?)

    - warranty offer at the moment with Toshiba says if it breaks we'll fix it and ALSO give you a refund!!! Thus, they must be confident of it's reliability

    - much less heat and noise; the HPs are said to get hot (ok, can live with that) and noisy due to the fan always coming on and spinning loudly (er, that's harder to live with)

    - better, slightly faster, CPU (Intel Core 2 vs AMD Turion)

    - slightly better battery life

    - current offer of £150 of Toshiba accessories for just the VAT cost, ie £22.50 (buy £150 ex VAT of Toshiba accessories from the options list and then apply for £150 cashback). ALTERNATIVE: 2 years of '3' mobile broadband for free via cashback , 24GB of data transfer so ~ 1GB per month, adaptor included

    Toshiba Cons:

    - £100 more expensive (TX2 starts from £799, M750 can be had from £900)

    - only single touch not multi

    - worse graphics (about 1/2 from benchmarks I've seen). HP actually appears to be a good gaming laptop and can play most modern games well. Though both laptops support DirectX 10 and shader model 4.

    Other points (some minor):

    - Wacom for the Toshiba, N-Trig for HP; Photoshop only supports Wacom, N-Trig 'dodgy' on the Dell Latitude XT (the other tablet with the same tech as the TX2), supposedly fine on HP but it's still early days

    - HP has remote control and MediaPlay software; also better speakers (and dual headphone jacks)

    - Toshiba has eraser on pen, emergency pen fitted on underside and can swap optical drive for space saver to reduce weight

    - Toshiba's screen has slightly better viewing angles than HP and not as reflective (TX2 screen is much better than TX2500's but is still a cheap panel)

    - both have fingerprint readers and optional webcams; Toshiba also has eSATA port and a powered-whilst-asleep USB port (to charge eg an iPod)

    - touchpad slightly better on the HP (dimpled surface)

    - There appears to be a £400 (HP) to £500 (Toshiba) premium for the tablet functionality over a laptop of similar specs without it, so be sure it'll be worth it for you

    In all, the Toshiba is more a 'professional/business' tablet than the HP's which are definitely 'consumer' bias.
     
  4. adam.mt

    adam.mt Super Moderator Senior Member

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    BTW, the HP TX2500/2600 series is available for just under £650 at the moment so the multi-touch of the TX2 is costing the buyer AT LEAST £150 (likely to be slightly more unless the UK's TX2 base option is well spec'ed at launch; looking at the US spec, if the UK's is the same, the difference will be like £250 for a TX2500 to TX2 like-for-like).

    Hope this has been some use. I've been doing tons of research the last few days, cause I was initially really attracted by the TX2. However, now I'm thinking an alternative, eg the Toshiba, would be more practical.

    (If you can stretch to £1000 then the Thinkpad X200 is also an option; but I've yet to read anything about the quality of it's touchscreen, all the reviews are versions without it)
     
  5. tlewis

    tlewis Scribbler - Standard Member

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  6. Adrian890

    Adrian890 Pen Pal - Newbie

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    Remember hp tx2 is a very powerful laptop not to mention a great tablet and future proof. I've looked at all the laptops u mentioned Adam and tx2 is the best in my opionion :)
     
  7. adam.mt

    adam.mt Super Moderator Senior Member

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    Adrian: The TX2 is basically the same as the TX2500/2600 series, just a different screen/digitizer. Check the specs or ask on the HP forum if you don't believe me. It uses a N-Trig capitance digitizer/touchscreen rather than a Wacom one which has pros (multi-touch) and cons (no Photoshop support and not yet proved). It also has a glossy LED backlit screen which is better than before. Otherwise it's identical.

    The M750 is faster, quieter and better designed than both HPs. On the negative side the graphics are worse, so if considering semi-serious gameplay the HPs are obviously a better bet.

    One of my points was that there's a £150-£250 premium for the multi-touch screen on the TX2 over the extremely similar tx2500/2600. Whether it's worth it is still open for debate and obviously personal preference.

    The other point I made was a detailed comparison of the differences between all three models. If I'm wrong on any points then please correct me, but I believe I'm accurate. A blanket statement without reasoning I don't think is helpful to anyone.

    Other than that which is best obviously depends on your exist needs/preferences and each one of the three could be best for different people.
     
  8. samson79

    samson79 Pen Pal - Newbie

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    Lenovo X200t does not cost around 1000£. It is around 1400£. (I found one X200t at 900£ but it is the one with the non-LED screen.
    Also the touch screen model is available on UK sites (even though they are german imports.

    Also, Toshiba M750 costs around 1150£

    Of course if tou have found the X200t with the LED screen around 1000£ on a UK site I would be glad to hear on which site :)
     
  9. adam.mt

    adam.mt Super Moderator Senior Member

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    tlewis: Thanks for the link, hadn't found that. Will be checking it out.

    samson79: You got me! :eek: Was actually thinking of it's predecessor the X61 for £1000. The X200 is indeed more expensive.

    Didn't say touch X200 wasn't available in UK, rather I said I hadn't seen any reviews of it. tlewis has now found one.

    That said Dabs and SCC have a german X200 tablet with touch and LED backlight for £908. So I'm not entirely wrong! (and guess could say have granted your wish :) )

    The Toshiba M750 is available for at a number of retailers for ~ £900 (inc VAT):
    www.oyyy.co.uk - £909
    www.it247.com - £900
    www.lambda-tek.com - £895
    www.digital-fusion.co.uk - £903
    www.ebuyer.com - £902
    www.micomonline.co.uk - £921
     
  10. samson79

    samson79 Pen Pal - Newbie

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    @adam.mt: Yes, my bad, M750 does cost ~900£. But the J model, the "small" one.
    As for the Lenovo... Dabs.com and SCC do list a X200t, german, with Touch for 900£ BUT I fear it is not the Touch. It is simply TOO cheap. And especially in dabs, they have two X200t listed.
    One at 900£, stated as Touchscreeen
    One at 1400£, stated as Touchscreen, with exactly the same specifications with the only difference that the Touchscreen is "IPS", implying that the screen of the first model is not IPS. And the only non-IPS screen for the X200t is the non-touch, non-LED one.
    Confusing.... And to be honest I do not trust them!
     
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