Could This Be The USB-C - Surface Connector?

Discussion in 'Microsoft' started by Steve S, Jul 13, 2017.

  1. Telstar1948

    Telstar1948 Scribbler - Standard Member

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    ...can't imagine why anyone would pay $700 for a non-upgradeable eGPU? I'm interested in eGPU's but only one where I can upgrade the card... I do understand that there are some compatibility issues with eGPU's depending on what you're hooking them up to, but if a fixed card somehow helps that problem then I suppose I'll have to wait until they come up with something better...
     
  2. dellaster

    dellaster Scribbler - Standard Member Senior Member

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    Well, yeah, you're paying an Apple tax for something like this and naturally Apple wants people to buy a completely new version rather than offer an upgradable one. :p

    An upgradable enclosure like the Razor Core X retails for $299 and the Radeon Pro 580 is currently another $311 at Amazon so the Apple eGPU price isn't completely out of line given the included docking ports and guarantee that it'll actually work well (with MacBook Pro 13 & 15, that is).

    But all that's beside the point I was after, which is that Apple doesn't seem to have a problem making TB3 work while Microsoft is still only able to make excuses.
     
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  3. dstrauss

    dstrauss Comic Relief Senior Member

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    WHAT HE SAID!!!
     
  4. Steve S

    Steve S Pen Pro - Senior Member Super Moderator

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    <<...all that's beside the point I was after, which is that Apple doesn't seem to have a problem making TB3 work while Microsoft is still only able to make excuses...>>

    ...No pun, but you're trying to compare apples and (sort of) oranges.

    Because Apple fully controls their hardware and software, they also fully control their interfaces (and they can choose what USB-C and Thunderbolt 3 functionalities they implement). They also approve the peripherals that you're allowed to plug in. Therefore, it's much easier for them to configure a USB-C / TB3 port for their products that works consistently the way they (not you) want it to.

    Microsoft's more open approach, on the other hand, creates many more potential opportunities for conflicts or problems to arise. Add to that that the other OEMs are free to implement, perhaps, other combinations of USB-C / TB3 functionality and those opportunities balloon. Meanwhile, Microsoft is trying to re-establish a track record for reliable operation and durability of their Surface line (and to mitigate the Consumer Reports fiasco). So they're 1) Trying to avoid any more operational problems, and 2) Waiting for USB-C preferred functionality to settle down a bit while 3) USB-C peripherals are only in small numbers and only just now starting to enter the mainstream in meaningful numbers. Panos said as much (I think on an AMA).

    I'm not totally happy with Microsoft's slow implementation of these features, but I also understand why Microsoft might want to drag its feet for a while longer.

    And we do have that sexy dongle, now!
     
  5. dstrauss

    dstrauss Comic Relief Senior Member

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    @Steve S - sorry to be a "nudge" but name for me one other first or even second tier Windows OEM that does not implement TB3...
     
  6. Steve S

    Steve S Pen Pro - Senior Member Super Moderator

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    Who gets blamed when it doesn't work the way the user expected (regardless of who might be at fault)...?

    Microsoft is, I think, playing the long game here for its own hardware.
     
  7. dellaster

    dellaster Scribbler - Standard Member Senior Member

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    @Steve S — Even if I grant you all that, it still seems to me that they're falling too far behind. Kinda like how they took it "slow and sure" with Windows Phone and Cortana and... too many to name?

    Like Apple they totally have control over their Surface hardware, firmware, and software. Peripherals, you'd need to take your chances just as you would if you tried to plug in that Razor eGPU enclosure on a MacBook Pro. I imagine the peripheral manufacturers would include compatibility in the specs, as is usually the case with anything.
     
  8. dstrauss

    dstrauss Comic Relief Senior Member

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    That still doesn't answer my question...
     
  9. Steve S

    Steve S Pen Pro - Senior Member Super Moderator

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    <<...Like Apple they totally have control over their Surface hardware, firmware, and software...>>

    ...Their hardware, yes. Hardware by other OEMS, not as much. Especially firmware and drivers (the latter controlling interfaces, among other things). Windows is expected to work with everyone's hardware. (And I'm not saying that there aren't specs and standards, of course there are. But design errors and intentional shortcuts happen, and that when trouble starts to develop.)

    <<...I imagine the peripheral manufacturers would include compatibility in the specs...>>

    ...Potentially big differences between intention to be compatible and actual compatibility with so many OEM hardware and driver configurations. Can you install just any driver on your Surface? No, because drivers are frequently tailored to the particular hardware suite that they have to operate in. Which brings us to...

    Testing. Tablets and laptops are complex and can assume many operating states. Times that by multiple OEMs. Windows has to work in all those settings. Testing all the myriad combinations is daunting, at best, as well as time-consuming and expensive. A lot of what goes wrong in the world of electronics has its roots in inadequate testing. Many companies don't have the resources to do it right, so they do what they can and then release the product anyway. My point here is that Windows often gets the blame for something that that someone else did (or didn't test adequately for).

    Also, we're quick to criticize design decisions while not knowing what the details were or what trades were considered. So Microsoft is late to the market with USB-C / TB3. Panos says they have their reasons. And Panos has some other important things to do in the near term. I say let him do them.

    If USB-3 / TB3 is a driving need, there are other brands that offer it.
     
  10. dellaster

    dellaster Scribbler - Standard Member Senior Member

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    Edit: Actually, nevermind. Microsoft has their reasons, just as Happy Days had their reasons to have Fonzie jump the shark. It's not my place to second guess. :rolleyes:

     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2018
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