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Can Microsoft Windows 8 Tablets Really Make a Dent in Apple iPad Sales? Discussion

Discussion in 'News Headlines' started by Michael Cohn, Jan 5, 2012.

  1. Michael Cohn

    Michael Cohn Pen Pal - Newbie Reviewer

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    Microsoft hopes to turn the momentum against the Apple iPad by offering a version of its upcoming Windows 8 operating system that will run on tablets. The software giant from Redmond will be waging an uphill battle, though, as many consumers have already settled on the iPad as their tablet of choice. Will Windows 8 really manage to make much of a dent against the iPad?



    Read the full content of this Article: Can Microsoft Windows 8 Tablets Really Make a Dent in Apple iPad Sales?

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    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 11, 2014
  2. dceggert

    dceggert Moving 'up' from iPAQ Senior Member

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    Michael,
    It may not be as big an uphill battle as one would think. Given the right price and capability, there is a huge potential to steal sales away from the iSystem. The HP Touchpad demonstrated that.

    The major issue that Apple has yet to address is one of capability. The iPad is great for browsing non-flash or 'mobile' websites, watching movies, reading the paper, a book, or texting/emailing, but besides it being fashionable, do we really need to spend $700 to do that?

    A TabletPC can do all those things, but up to this point, not as smoothly. But what a Windows TabletPC can also do is run productivity software, databases, and update work documents. The single biggest holdup to a wide scale adoption of the TabletPC is cost.

    In an age of $199 Kindle Fires, $400 Android tablets, and $700 iPads, a $900 TabletPC is still out of the range of contention.

    To add to the point, I know of 3 people that have iPads that sit unused that they received as gifts. I also know 2 people that bought (1) Kindle and another bought (1) Android tablet that are not happy - they wanted to match what I do with my Q550 without spending the money for a Q550 and it isn't working out for them. And then I have one iPad owner friend that swears it is the greatest thing to ever happen since the smartphone; she uses it only for email and facebook.

    If someone told you that it would cost $700 to access email and facebook what would you say?

    So now let me ask, if having access to email and facebook is worth $700, how much is the value for having access to corporate email, sharepoint servers, and office applications? If that would be, say, worth $400, then a $900 TabletPC is actually a great value. If it is not worth it to you, then the iPad is a better machine.

    It is all a matter of perspective.
  3. kote1010

    kote1010 Pen Pal - Newbie

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    I think if Microsoft and their hardware partners can make a sufficient case that you are really getting a two-for-one deal, units will sell. Think about it: you spend 600 on an IPad/Android tablet and another 500-700 on a personal pc, totaling out at 1100-1300 bucks. I'm willing to spend 1100 to 1300 on ONE powerful computer that I can use in a tablet or a laptop computing experience and allows for comparable Wacom performance with the digitizer pen. Really I'm getting 3 devices in one for less than $3K. Good deal in my opinion.
    Significant app development is a must, but really only in the gaming/social media categories. I don't need productivity, multimedia, or utility apps really-- that's the whole point of having a Windows 7/8 tablet.
    I would say what really needs to happen is better battery tech and smaller/slimmer chargers and the better touch-friendliness, which is the whole point of Win8, so that's covered.
    I don't think Microsoft will find it hard to capture the market really.
  4. bayarea650

    bayarea650 Pen Pal - Newbie

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    The variety of tablets going into the market inevitably make a dent in iPad sales, but as far as I'm concerned they're just cheaper (sometimes more expensive) knock-offs boasting 'more features' that most consumers aren't interested in.

    TabletPC's are great for power users who want all the features their laptop has in a smaller form factor. The iPad simplified all that and created a device most people wouldn't be intimated to use because of a convoluted offering of features most will never use. That's the reason why it has dominated the marketshare to this point. The majority of users aren't power users.

    I remember the first generation of TabletPCs back in the early 2000's. Besides the hassle of using the stylus, they flopped because companies believed people wanted these devices as a smaller version of their laptops. They didn't realize usability and ease-of-use is as much of a factor is portability. They just slapped on WindowsME and some handwriting recognition and called it a day. The reason Apple products tend to do better is because their designs are better thought out and are enjoyable to use to the average consumer.
  5. excalibur1814

    excalibur1814 Scribbler - Standard Member Senior Member

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    It's as simple as this...

    People follow the crowd. The non-techies out there don't care about this or that, they simply follow what's new, trendy and happening.

    Once Windows 8 hits I'm hoping that a wave of simple, easy to understand information will be there and then people will just buy tablets with Windows 8.

    Another aspect is the kids... IF the kids love Windows 8 and start asking for it the parents will fall in line.


    Simple.


    However, I'm afraid, that the one thing holding back Windows 8 are the oems. They'll probably fill their devices with absolute rubbish and users will instantly install everything from Google and Apple (iTunes) which will slow the devices and who gets the blame for that? Microsoft (Just as they did for the oems shipping Vista with only 256Mb ram). Microsoft NEEDS to STOP software makers from even looking at the services list let alone the startup menu.

    We NEED that standard hardware limit that's being imposed by microsoft. ALL Tablets must meet or excel that limit to ensure the end user is happy, using the device and not moaning. Will that happen? Depends on how lazy Acer, Toshiba, Sony, Dell and the others are.
  6. Steve S

    Steve S Scribbler - Standard Member Super Moderator

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    <<...I think if Microsoft and their hardware partners can make a sufficient case that you are really getting a two-for-one deal...>>

    ...A recent family experience may be relevant, here.

    My daughter is about as technically dis-inclined as it is possible to be in this day and age. This Christmas, she got both a new laptop (to replace her six-year old laptop) and a Kindle Fire. I helped her to set up her laptop, initializing Windows and installing Office and deciding which of the usual bloatware apps she considered worthy of installing.

    One of them was an e-book reader. She looked at it and said: "...so my laptop does everything that the Kindle does?"

    "...Yes"

    "Well then, why do I need it...?"

    I'm pretty sure that she left the Kindle behind when she returned to college this morning.
  7. Jamison Cush

    Jamison Cush TechnologyGuide Editor Staff Member

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    Does anyone here feel that Microsoft's failure to gain significant market share with Windows Phone 7 portends bad things for its chances of success with ARM tablets?
  8. Steve B

    Steve B Moderator Moderator

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    To me, no, I'm not concerned because they're two different markets. The iPhone offers an experience you can't get on a win7 desktop yet, so I'm not surprised it's continued to dominate. The Windows phone OS doesn't offer anything special yet, even if it offers a good user experience But on a tablet, where you can run real applications? Then I think it's offering something new and competitive, that you can't get on an iPad. The Win Phone GUI is a nice bonus, but not the real reason I'm looking forward to Win8- it's the ARM compatibility so that I can run real apps on devices similar to the IPad in build. Honestly, even if it was just the normal desktop experience, I'd still be excited because it's functionality I'm after. The interface is really more about redefining the public image of Windows IMO- good for marketing, but less important than true application based functionality. It's not unimportant, of course, just less IMO.
  9. excalibur1814

    excalibur1814 Scribbler - Standard Member Senior Member

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    I don't. Windows 8 will be in everyone's face when they enter ANY and every single computer store while the shops over here in the UK are barely even mentioning Windows phone 7 when new customers walk in. In the UK, at least, I feel that this reason alone it hasn't taken off. You can shove never ending adverts but until the buzz starts nothing happens. MS could spend millions and millions while all they need is ONE... one single darn game changing application/game and the news will spread through the youngsters and BAM that's the job done.

    As it stands Apple gathered the kids in with the iPods, then the iPhone and the rest is history.

    If anything Windows 8 will help push Windows on the phone AS LONG as they push the integration aspect. Oh yeah... and tell people like Nokia and HTC to make sexy phones or else the younger kids won't notice even if they ARE interested. As for Arm tablets... same as above.. make sexy apps/games and they will buy. Was there anything fantastic at the launch of the HP Touchpad or Rim playbook? Nope. Oh well.
  10. jnjroach

    jnjroach Scribbler - Standard Member Super Moderator

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    But we do not yet know if Windows on Arm (WoA) will run what you are referring to as "Real" Applications. Are you wanting to run Quicken on WoA? Office 2010? My guess is new versions of core titles written in HTML 5 as Chromeless Metro Apps we be available at launch but I doubt legacy applications will run on WoA.

    If we see a bunch of WoA consumer tablets, Metro will offer a very good touch experience but moving into a Desktop Environment, MS risks getting bashed for not having a "touch friendly" UI by all of the Tech Pundits (present editorial staff included). I'm not sure we'll see what many in the TabletPC Community is wanting (Full Desktop plus Metro on WoA)

    I assume Windows 8 on x86 will run Desktop Applications as they won't need to be re-compiled.

    We will hopefully know more starting next week at CES and as the Windows 8 Beta gets closer (I assume some time in Q1 C2012 based on Build in September).
  11. dceggert

    dceggert Moving 'up' from iPAQ Senior Member

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    Jamison,
    I was a long time user of the Windows Mobile PDA before stepping up a bit in size to a TabletPC. My old PDA's would do almost everything my TabletPC does but with a 4" screen instead of a 10.1". My advice to you is to get a hold of an HP 21x series PDA off eBay and see what I mean. It would make for a great case study leading up to a Windows Phone 7 re-examination. You could use it to form a basis for not only Phone 7 but also Win 8 for ARM when it comes out.

    Now, with that said, realize that Microsoft has been making ARM based 'Windows' machines since about 1995 in the form of said PDA OS. The 'Windows' has been Windows CE, or in later iterations, Windows Mobile. Microsoft has a lot of experience with ARM based Windows already, and I would not be surprised if 'Windows 8 for ARM' is not just a rehash of Windows CE with the new Metro home screen with drivers to handle larger screens. They already have the infrastructure, the 'apps', and the track record of making it all work together.

    So, why am I here if all this worked for so long (I gave up my PDA in 2005 for a HP TC1100 and immediately liked the machine but wished it were 5" instead of 10.4")? Why not just use a Windows Phone 7?

    What Microsoft did was abandon the PDA market to get into smartphones thinking that was where the money was moving. Strike 1 - the PDA OS was no longer supported and they lost miserably in that market. Microsoft then came out with Windows Phone 7 - Strike 2 - they walked away from the major reason for having the PDA device in the first place...a mobile computer.

    When Microsoft insisted that Mobile Office go 100% 'cloud' based it lost me and many others as a user. I cannot store my documents in the cloud, it is a breech of corporate security.

    This all sounds like I only use this technology for corporate use only; I do not. But I do mingle work and home together with Scouts and other groups that store sensitive material (SS numbers, photos, address lists, etc.) that shoud not be in the cloud either. The idea of having useful technology is to use it and Phone 7 cannot work for me. If Microsoft made Phone 7 be able to store information on SD card, even if it were micro-SD, I would have one in a heartbeat.

    So in my case, Phone 7 is a waste of effort and it does not surprise me it is not being adopted faster.

    What if Microsoft touted a 4" ARM based tablet running Windows 8 for ARM that would store things on an SD card, have handwriting recognition, run for 3 days without charging, play your music, browse the web, have Facebook apps, Google apps, games up the wazzu, and fit in your pocket...sound cool? Buy a HP 21x PDA, it is OLD TECH!

    Edit: I just decided to keep my HP 211 instead of selling it. When Windows 8 for ARM is released I am going to try to squeeze it on it! I have already tried Linux (it is useless for that little device) and I understand there are those with Android running on them now, but how cool would it be to use the old ARM PocketPC with Win 8 on it?
  12. Steve B

    Steve B Moderator Moderator

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    If users will be unable to run "real" Windows applications on ARM Win8 tablets, then yes, I think it will be dead in the water as a way for Microsoft to enter the tablet market. It is that functionality in a mobile, light, easy to use, touch enabled device with good battery life that makes Win8 exciting. We'll see.

    Edit: Dceggert, that tablet description above sounds like a Galaxy Note- just running Win8 instead of Android. That's the kind of market Win8 could be getting into. Just think how much more awesome some of these phone/tablets would be if they ran Win8, or atleast the Win8 I hope is coming out. It's not the tech that's the issue- it's the OS and general functionality.
  13. Bronsky

    Bronsky Wait and Hope. Senior Member

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    Should I go digging in the closet for my old Compaq Ipaq 3630? I had a really nice leather case that was modified to hold an SD card.:D
  14. bloodycape

    bloodycape Scribbler - Standard Member Senior Member

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    Lol, I had a HP ipaq(forget what model it was) that was running WM 2003SE, that has a camera with a flash on it, and doubled as a universal remote all on a nice 3.5in screen. I really miss devices like that, and I hope Win8 can bring some of that back for me, but in a larger 8-9in screen and with multi-touch capacitive screen.
  15. heatlesssun

    heatlesssun Scribbler - Standard Member

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    One of the BIGGEST problems for Windows Phone is the number of phones, indeed there is still only ONE Windows Phone available on both Verizon and Sprint.

    Windows 8 will not have that problem.
  16. dstrauss

    dstrauss Comic Relief Senior Member

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    Gadget Lust - an uncontrollable desire to own a techno product you don't "really" need. Well, it hit me right between the eyes with the Samsung Series 7 Slate this morning. Finally got my delivery: ladies and gentlemen it is gorgeous and if it is ANY kind of representative of the near future Win 8 x86 and ARM tablets, WINDOWS IS BACK!

    You have to experience this thing to understand how amazing it appears and feels. Yes, it is .51" thick, but just like the iPad 1 that is hidden by curved inward edges. Folks, this thing is about 1/8" thicker, 1/2" wider, and 1" narrower (top to bottom) than THE SCREEN on my HP 2740p tablet. Its has an i5 processor, 4gb RAM, and 128gb SSD, AND LONGER BATTERY LIFE, in that small of a shell. I can't even imagine what will be coming out next fall with the general release of Win8.

    Microsoft is only 2/3 of the way there though (and since this is only Win 7 at this time, I may be overly euphoric - no, not really). IF (the big IF) Microsoft Metrofies OneNote and the rest of Office 2010, and REALLY pushes OneNote as the killer app for their new platform, they will give even the vaunted iPad a run for its money. And now that Sammy has proven that Wacom can come in a small slide in stick (Galaxy Note) we can once again have silos in our tablets.

    Yes, I am jazzed! No, it can't be as small as the Slate 500, but that right now is a screen res question caused by Microsoft in order to ensure it will get split window treatment. Folks, if you have a Microsoft brick and mortar store in your neighborhood, race down there and see it for yourself. Yes, it is pricey if you missed the 25% off blowout sale at year end ($1299 retail vs $974 - however, if you order online comes with the dock, saving you $100, and a $200 coupon for next order - eg, Office 2010 for free), but they got (or are getting) it right.

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